- From: Bernadette Farias Lóscio <bfl@cin.ufpe.br>
- Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2016 15:38:00 -0300
- To: Annette Greiner <amgreiner@lbl.gov>
- Cc: Phil Archer <phila@w3.org>, "Phillips, Addison" <addison@lab126.com>, Deirdre Lee <deirdre@derilinx.com>, "ishida@w3.org" <ishida@w3.org>, "public-dwbp-comments@w3.org" <public-dwbp-comments@w3.org>, www International <www-international@w3.org>
- Message-ID: <CANx1Pzws2t_2jqdncq_iGWmv2cvvOQrG8ynDDa09GvF+7PSngw@mail.gmail.com>
Hi Annette,
thanks for your answer! Just a brief explanation: I understood that
"2015-05-05"
is also *data* and because of this I said that it is an example of
locale-neutral representation.
I have just two more questions:
- I am still not sure if we should keep "dct:conformsTo". Should we keep
it?
- I understand that to have an example of locale-neutral representation we
should present some instances from the dataset. But I don't see how to do
this considering the dataset attributes and their corresponding data types
[1]. Could you please give me an example?
cheers,
Bernadette
[1] http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/dwbp-example.html#dataset-structural-metadata
2016-08-24 14:32 GMT-03:00 Annette Greiner <amgreiner@lbl.gov>:
> I think it's a fine idea to put both the locale-neutral and the metadata
> approaches into example 13, but the metadata is not an example of a
> locale-neutral representation of the *data*. We need to show that in the
> data itself.
>
> -Annette
>
> On 8/24/16 4:56 AM, Bernadette Farias Lóscio wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> @Phil, thanks a lot for making the updates! @Annette and Addison thanks
> for the comments and suggestions!
>
> I agree with the changes made until now, but I'd like to answer the
> following comment:
>
> Finally, the example marked prominently as Example 13 looks like the
>>> primary suggestion for implementing the BP, which it isn't anymore. I
>>> think the 2000 Euro example should be at least as prominently marked.
>>>
>>
>> I sympathise but I'm going to have to leave that to the editors. It can
>> be done by simply adding class="example" to the <pre> element. But, doing
>> that then means that the example numbers will be out of step with the BP
>> numbers from that that point on, which I *think* editors have been anxious
>> to avoid?
>>
>>
> I don't think its a good idea to change the numbers of the examples. One
> solution could be to make some changes on the example 13.
>
> Example 13 shows both the use of locale-neutral representation and
> locale-parameters metadata. We have the tag "xsd:date" in 'dct:issued
> "2015-05-05"^^xsd:date', but we also have 'dct:conformsTo <
> http://www.iso.org/iso/home/standards/iso8601.htm>' to indicate the
> standard adopted as date format.
>
> :stops-2015-05-05
>
> a dcat:Dataset ;
> dct:title "Bus stops of MyCity" ;
> dcat:keyword "transport","mobility","bus" ;
> dct:issued "2015-05-05"^^xsd:date ;
> dcat:contactPoint <http://data.mycity.example.com/transport/contact>
> ;
> dct:temporal <http://reference.data.gov.uk/id/year/2015> ;
> dct:spatial <http://www.geonames.org/3399415> ;
> dct:publisher :transport-agency-mycity ;
> dct:accrualPeriodicity <http://purl.org/linked-data/
> sdmx/2009/code#freq-A> ;
> dcat:theme :mobility ;
> dcat:distribution :stops-2015-05-05.csv ;
> dct:language <http://id.loc.gov/vocabulary/iso639-1/en> ,
> <http://id.loc.gov/vocabulary/iso639-1/pt> ;
> dct:conformsTo <http://www.iso.org/iso/home/standards/iso8601.htm>
> ;
> .
>
> Should we have both ou just xsd:date? If I understood correct, I think we
> should keep just xsd:date. In this case, we can also change the example
> description to mention that we are using a locale-neutral representation
> for date and a locale-parameter metadata (dct:language) to specify the
> languages in which dataset is published. See the suggestion below:
>
> The example below shows the use of xsd:date providing a local-neutral
> representation for the issue date of the bus stops dataset (
> stops-2015-05-05). Considering that the data from the bus stops dataset
> is already in a locale-specific format, then the property dct:language
> is used to declare the languages the dataset is published in. If the
> dataset is available in multiple languages, use multiple values for this
> property.
>
> :stops-2015-05-05
>
> a dcat:Dataset ;
> dct:title "Bus stops of MyCity" ;
> dcat:keyword "transport","mobility","bus" ;
> dct:issued "2015-05-05"^^xsd:date ;
> dcat:contactPoint <http://data.mycity.example.com/transport/contact>
> ;
> dct:temporal <http://reference.data.gov.uk/id/year/2015> ;
> dct:spatial <http://www.geonames.org/3399415> ;
> dct:publisher :transport-agency-mycity ;
> dct:accrualPeriodicity <http://purl.org/linked-data/
> sdmx/2009/code#freq-A> ;
> dcat:theme :mobility ;
> dcat:distribution :stops-2015-05-05.csv ;
> dct:language <http://id.loc.gov/vocabulary/iso639-1/en> ,
> <http://id.loc.gov/vocabulary/iso639-1/pt> ;
>
>
> Please, let me know what do you think about this.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Berna
>
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>>> -Annette
>>>
>>>
>>> On 8/23/16 7:11 AM, Phillips, Addison wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Phil,
>>>>
>>>> Thanks. This looks good to me.
>>>>
>>>> Addison
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: Phil Archer [mailto:phila@w3.org]
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2016 3:29 AM
>>>>> To: Phillips, Addison <addison@lab126.com>; Deirdre Lee
>>>>> <deirdre@derilinx.com>; Bernadette Farias Lóscio <bfl@cin.ufpe.br>;
>>>>> Annette Greiner <amgreiner@lbl.gov>
>>>>> Cc: ishida@w3.org; public-dwbp-comments@w3.org; www International
>>>>> <www-international@w3.org>
>>>>> Subject: Re: [i18n review comment] BP3 should recommend locale-neutral
>>>>> representation #187
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks again Addison,
>>>>>
>>>>> Pls see below.
>>>>>
>>>>> On 22/08/2016 18:36, Phillips, Addison wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Phil,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This looks good. A few comments.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. Rather than providing your own definition for 'locale', you might
>>>>>> make
>>>>>>
>>>>> use of the one we provide in LTLI [1].
>>>>>
>>>>> Done
>>>>> http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/bp.html#locale_parameter
>>>>>
>>>>> 2. The "why" is still missing something. I would suggest adding a
>>>>>> new first
>>>>>>
>>>>> paragraph explaining locale-neutral first. Something like:
>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Data values that are machine-readable and not specific to any
>>>>>> particular
>>>>>>
>>>>> language or culture are more durable and less open to
>>>>> misinterpretation than
>>>>> values that use one of the many different cultural representations.
>>>>> By using a
>>>>> locale-neutral format, systems avoid the need to establish specific
>>>>> interchange rules that vary according to the language or location of
>>>>> the user.
>>>>>
>>>>>> When the data is already in a locale-specific format, providing locale
>>>>>> parameters... <rest of existing text>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Done, exactly as you suggest
>>>>> http://w3c.github.io/dwbp/bp.html#LocaleParametersMetadata
>>>>>
>>>>> With luck... the doc gets a green light from you?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks again
>>>>>
>>>>> Phil.
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hope that helps,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Addison
>>>>>>
>>>>>> [1] https://www.w3.org/TR/ltli/#locale
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: Phil Archer [mailto:phila@w3.org]
>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, August 22, 2016 2:34 AM
>>>>>>> To: Deirdre Lee <deirdre@derilinx.com>; Phillips, Addison
>>>>>>> <addison@lab126.com>; Bernadette Farias Lóscio <bfl@cin.ufpe.br>;
>>>>>>> Annette Greiner <amgreiner@lbl.gov>
>>>>>>> Cc: ishida@w3.org; public-dwbp-comments@w3.org; www International
>>>>>>> <www-international@w3.org>
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [i18n review comment] BP3 should recommend
>>>>>>> locale-neutral representation #187
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dear all,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have taken further steps on this. The result can be seen at
>>>>>>> http://philarcher1.github.io/dwbp/bp.html#LocaleParametersMetadata
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 1. Addision's text used more or less verbatim; 1a. taken account of
>>>>>>> Annette's suggestion; 1b. replaced inline links to BCP47 and CLDR
>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> references 2.
>>>>>
>>>>>> title of the BP changed to Use locale-neutral data representations 3.
>>>>>>> moved to Data Formats section as resolved in WG meeting on Friday; 4.
>>>>>>> added R- FormatMachineRead to list of evidence and thereby updated
>>>>>>> the UCR cross matching; 5. updated the Challenges SVG diagram; 6.
>>>>>>> updated my Pull request.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> NB, I *retained* the old ID for the BP so that any links to
>>>>>>> #LocaleParametersMetadata will still work. I know there are some of
>>>>>>> these, for example, in the Share-PSI project.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> HTH
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Phil.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 22/08/2016 08:52, Deirdre Lee wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> HI,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thank you for your comments Addison. I think they make sense and
>>>>>>>> should be straight-forward to incorporate.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The title of the BP should probably also be updated to something
>>>>>>>> like 'Provide locale-neutral data'
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Phil and DWBP editors, in Friday's meeting we also agreed to move
>>>>>>>> BP3 to the Data Formats section from the Metadata section, which
>>>>>>>> would make it BP14, right?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Deirdre
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 19/08/2016 17:39, Phillips, Addison wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hi Phil,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks for starting on this. I think the pull request is a good
>>>>>>>>> start.
>>>>>>>>> I have some comments on it.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> My main concern is that this BP is really backwards. It recommends
>>>>>>>>> to "locale parameter metadata" and then says that the simplest way
>>>>>>>>> to do this is to use locale-neutral formats. The recommendation
>>>>>>>>> should be more like "use locale-neutral formats or provide
>>>>>>>>> locale/language information where that's not possible". The pull
>>>>>>>>> request captures the use of locale-neutral, but doesn't really
>>>>>>>>> explain about when to provide locale and language information.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I would change this:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> <p class="practicedesc">Provide metadata about locale parameters
>>>>>>>>> (date, time, and number formats, language).</p>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> To say:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> <p class="practicedesc">Use locale-neutral data structures and
>>>>>>>>> values, or, where that is not possible, provide metadata about the
>>>>>>>>> locale used by data values.</p>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I would change:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> <p>The simplest method is to use local-neutral representations of
>>>>>>>>> the actual data, and then add metadata to provide relevant locale
>>>>>>>>> information. For example, rather than storing "€2000.00" as a
>>>>>>>>> string, it's strongly preferred to exchange a data structure such
>>>>>>>>> as:</p>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> To say:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> <p>Most common data representations are locale neutral. For
>>>>>>>>> example, XML Schema types such as xsd:integer and xsd: date are
>>>>>>>>> intended for locale-neutral data interchange. Using locale-neutral
>>>>>>>>> representations allows the data values to be processed accurately
>>>>>>>>> without complex parsing or misinterpretation and also allows the
>>>>>>>>> data to be presented in the format most comfortable for the
>>>>>>>>> consumer of the data. For example, rather than storing "€2000,00"
>>>>>>>>> as a string, it's strongly preferred to exchange a data structure
>>>>>>>>> such as:</p>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Also, note the misspelling of "locale-neutral" in the pull request.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I would then go on to add some text about when locale parameters
>>>>>>>>> are needed. Something like:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> Some datasets contain values that are not or cannot be rendered
>>>>>>>>> into a locale-neutral format. This is particularly true of any
>>>>>>>>> natural language text values. For each data field that can contain
>>>>>>>>> locale affected or natural language text, there should be an
>>>>>>>>> associated language tag used to indicate the language and locale
>>>>>>>>> of the
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> data.
>>>>>
>>>>>> This locale information can be used in parsing the data or to
>>>>>>>>> ensure proper presentation and processing of the value by the
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> consumer.
>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> (Sorry for not generating a pull request of my own)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Addison
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>> From: Phil Archer [mailto:phila@w3.org]
>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 8:37 AM
>>>>>>>>>> To: Bernadette Farias Lóscio <bfl@cin.ufpe.br>; Annette Greiner
>>>>>>>>>> <amgreiner@lbl.gov>
>>>>>>>>>> Cc: Phillips, Addison <addison@lab126.com>; ishida@w3.org;
>>>>>>>>>> public-dwbp- comments@w3.org; www International
>>>>>>>>>> <www-international@w3.org>
>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [i18n review comment] BP3 should recommend
>>>>>>>>>> locale-neutral representation #187
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I took an action on today's call to try and address this in BP3.
>>>>>>>>>> You can see the results at
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> http://philarcher1.github.io/dwbp/bp.html#LocaleParametersMe
>>>>> tadata
>>>>>
>>>>>> This uses some of Addison's text directly and highlights the value
>>>>>>>>>> of the xsd datatypes - but retains enough of the original BP for
>>>>>>>>>> it to be an amendment rather than a whole new one - I hope.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> This addresses most of the resolution taken today [1] but I have
>>>>>>>>>> not moved the BP to the formats section. I leave that to the
>>>>>>>>>> editors who may want to make further changes - or argue for it to
>>>>>>>>>> be left where it is, or add references from the formats section
>>>>>>>>>> or, or,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> or...
>>>>>
>>>>>> I've created the Pull Request https://github.com/w3c/dwbp/pull/447
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Phil.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> [1] https://www.w3.org/2016/08/19-dwbp-minutes#resolution02
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On 15/08/2016 17:28, Bernadette Farias Lóscio wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Ishida,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> This comment [1] is still under discussion [4] and we'd like to
>>>>>>>>>>> ask your opinion about two of our proposals:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> 1. to include locale-neutral representation ideas as part of BP3
>>>>>>>>>>> [2], or 2. to include a paragraph at the introduction of Section
>>>>>>>>>>> 8.8 Data Formats [3] to discuss the relevance of having
>>>>>>>>>>> local-neutral representations.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> We also discussed the proposal of having a new BP and we agreed
>>>>>>>>>>> that we won't have a lot of time for a broader review of the new
>>>>>>>>>>> BP and to collect feedback from the community.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks a lot!
>>>>>>>>>>> DWBP editors
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> [1] https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-dwbp-comments/
>>>>>>>>>>> 2016Jul/0028.html
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> [2]http://agreiner.github.io/dwbp/bp.html#LocaleParametersMe
>>>>>>> tadata
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> [3] https://www.w3.org/TR/dwbp/#dataFormats
>>>>>>>>>>> [4]
>>>>>>>>>>> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-dwbp-wg/2016Aug/0009
>>>>>>>>>>> .
>>>>>>>>>>> ht
>>>>>>>>>>> ml
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> 2016-08-04 23:26 GMT+02:00 Annette Greiner <amgreiner@lbl.gov>:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Addison,
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for your response, and it does make sense. I think what I
>>>>>>>>>>>> am still missing is whether there is guidance we can point to as
>>>>>>>>>>>> to how to represent the "locale-neutral" data so that it can
>>>>>>>>>>>> most easily be made locale specific by existing tools. You
>>>>>>>>>>>> mention "pre-made standards for the basic data types". Is there
>>>>>>>>>>>> a recommended list we could
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> reference?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for your help!
>>>>>>>>>>>> -Annette
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 8/4/16 12:31 PM, Phillips, Addison wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Annette,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for the note. This is a personal reply not on behalf of
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the WG.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Locale neutral formats are quite common on the Web and the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Internet in general. One familiar format referenced by your
>>>>>>>>>>>>> document, for example, is XML Schema. While the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> representations
>>>>>
>>>>>> of numbers, dates, and the like in XML Schema would be "more
>>>>>>>>>>>>> appropriate" for some languages/locales than others if given as
>>>>>>>>>>>>> plain text, what distinguishes them is that they are all
>>>>>>>>>>>>> machine readable and intended to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> be read by machines for later processing.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The display of values is a separate, local, concern for the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> data's consumer. This necessarily means choosing specific
>>>>>>>>>>>>> separators (such as decimal separators) over other, more
>>>>>>>>>>>>> localized values. Save for "free
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> text"
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> (natural language) data, most data formats are locale neutral
>>>>>>>>>>>>> and these include things like JSON-LD, XML Schema, CSV, and so
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> forth.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Not every possible data structure or data value is, of course,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> covered fully. For example, in my day job (I work at Amazon),
>>>>>>>>>>>>> we have many different common measurement units defined
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> internally.
>>>>>
>>>>>> To transmit these in a locale-neutral manner, we need to
>>>>>>>>>>>>> construct our own data schemas and identifiers. There are
>>>>>>>>>>>>> profoundly many ways to measure shoes, dresses, auto parts,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> hats, drone propellers, and so forth. But it would be a
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nightmare to have to deal with localized
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> presentation formats on top of that.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> But there are pre-made standards for the basic data types and
>>>>>>>>>>>>> these are what are needed to build almost any data structure
>>>>>>>>>>>>> necessary for global interchange of data.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Does that make sense?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Addison
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Addison Phillips
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Principal SDE, I18N Architect (Amazon) Chair (W3C I18N WG)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Internationalization is not a feature.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> It is an architecture.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: Annette Greiner [mailto:amgreiner@lbl.gov]
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2016 12:04 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: ishida@w3.org; public-dwbp-comments@w3.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cc: www International <www-international@w3.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [i18n review comment] BP3 should recommend
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> locale-neutral representation #187
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello on behalf of the DWBP WG,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We're interested in pursuing this concept in our best practice
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> document, but we would like some clarification of the practice
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of locale neutrality.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mention the variation across locales in decimal symbol,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> grouping symbol, number of grouping digits, digit shapes,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> etc., and you give an example of a locale-neutral data
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> structure for monetary
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> values.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But this structure alone does not appear to address
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> differences in decimal symbol, grouping symbol, number of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> grouping digits, or digit shapes. It does provide a mechanism
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to separately specify the units, and the example uses an
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ISO-4217 currency code, both of which we agree are good ideas.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Is there a broad standard (beyond just monetary) for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> addressing the other symbol/representation issues you raised
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that we can address
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> briefly in our best practice?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Do you consider SI units consistent with a locale-neutral
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> approach?
>>>>>
>>>>>> Is there a locale-neutral standard for representing decimal
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> numbers (perhaps using a period and no grouping, as in your
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> example)?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -Annette
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 7/22/16 5:32 AM, ishida@w3.org wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [raised by aphillips]
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://www.w3.org/TR/dwbp/#LocaleParametersMetadata
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Best practice #3 introduces itself as:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Providing locale parameters helps humans and computer
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> applications to work accurately with things like dates,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> currencies and numbers that may look similar but have
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> different meanings in different locales.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> But the actual best practice is to use **locale-neutral**
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> representations that are interpreted/displayed to end-users
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in a locale-appropriate manner. For example, instead of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> storing the string "€2000.00", exchanging a data structure
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like the following is strongly
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> preferred:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ```
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "price" {
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "value": 2000.00,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "currency": "EUR"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> }
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ```
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The date examples given are all in xsd:date format, which is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> an excellent example of using a locale-neutral format.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Many things are dependent on locale: decimal symbol,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> grouping
>>>>>
>>>>>> symbol, number of grouping digits, digit shapes, etc. It's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> because there can be wide variation (sometimes open to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> misinterpretation) that sending a locale neutral format is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> preferred for data values.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Note also btw that the position of the currency symbol is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dependent on the locale. In France it would be normal to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> write
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2000.00 € rather than €2000.00.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Same even when talking about USD when using $, ie. 2000.00 $.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Annette Greiner
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> NERSC Data and Analytics Services Lawrence Berkeley National
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Laboratory
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>> Annette Greiner
>>>>>>>>>>>> NERSC Data and Analytics Services Lawrence Berkeley National
>>>>>>>>>>>> Laboratory
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Phil Archer
>>>>>>>>>> W3C Data Activity Lead
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.w3.org/2013/data/
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> http://philarcher.org
>>>>>>>>>> +44 (0)7887 767755
>>>>>>>>>> @philarcher1
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Phil Archer
>>>>>>> W3C Data Activity Lead
>>>>>>> http://www.w3.org/2013/data/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://philarcher.org
>>>>>>> +44 (0)7887 767755 <%2B44%20%280%297887%20767755>
>>>>>>> @philarcher1
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Phil Archer
>>>>> W3C Data Activity Lead
>>>>> http://www.w3.org/2013/data/
>>>>>
>>>>> http://philarcher.org
>>>>> +44 (0)7887 767755 <%2B44%20%280%297887%20767755>
>>>>> @philarcher1
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> --
>>
>>
>> Phil Archer
>> W3C Data Activity Lead
>> http://www.w3.org/2013/data/
>>
>> http://philarcher.org
>> +44 (0)7887 767755 <%2B44%20%280%297887%20767755>
>> @philarcher1
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Bernadette Farias Lóscio
> Centro de Informática
> Universidade Federal de Pernambuco - UFPE, Brazil
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------------
>
>
> --
> Annette Greiner
> NERSC Data and Analytics Services
> Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory
>
>
>
--
Bernadette Farias Lóscio
Centro de Informática
Universidade Federal de Pernambuco - UFPE, Brazil
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Received on Wednesday, 24 August 2016 18:38:53 UTC