Re: Verifiable Claims Telecon Minutes for 2016-02-09

Is it trusting the entity or the validity of the document and the contents
of that document?

Ie: birth certificate, passport are documents. Yet they are factored to
provide trust about the subject of that document, sometimes only to
specified systems (ie: e-passport, I don't think it can easily be read
outside of customs machinery). The production of those materials are
produced as to make the document tamper evident and/or, so they can be
validated to a level of certainty.

Rather than specifically trusting something about another entity, it's more
about being able to trust the document IMHO.

Yet, banking cards are less considered documents and moreover instruments.
The instrument is issued to the holder, who presents and authenticates for
use of the card to initiate an electronic IOU. Is the transaction ledger
therefore the document subject linked to the (payment) instrument?

Perhaps therefore It's a verifable claims instrument, which in-turn becomes
bonded to a verifable document.

I think therein, I see a differentiation between the concept of the
document and the instrument. The credential instrument is generated and
stored, in association to the production and use of a trusted document.
This can then be presented, and verified for use by a valid recipient.

I would have thought Multiple agents may be involved in verification,
Depends on the nature of the claims structure doesn't it? Assuming it's not
necessarily always singular..?

Eg: Different departments of gov, for instance, are responsible for
different claims that end-up getting bundled for other instruments.

In theory, I would have thought each department would be able to maintain
their own elements, involved in the bundled claim, should they choose to...?

Tim.

On Tue, 16 Feb 2016 at 1:56 AM, Dave Longley <dlongley@digitalbazaar.com>
wrote:

> On 02/15/2016 08:51 AM, Shane McCarron wrote:
> > Hmm.  But a "consumer" might not be the one doing the verification.  A
> > consumer is the one that needs the claim to be true (presumably).
>
> That's my concern as well. We could do something new with the entire
> terminology like "issuing party", "holding party",
> "storage/aggregator/curator/agent party", "interested party", where
> "interested party" takes over for "consumer".
>
> The "consumer" is the party that needs trust in the credential holder in
> order for it to do something. They are a "relying party", an "interested
> party", and sometimes a "service provider" (but not always). They are
> the party that wants to know (and be able to trust) something about
> another entity (for some reason). I don't know if any of that helps
> anyone think of a better name.
>
> > Requestor is more accurate in the case where we are talking about the
> > entity that is asking the holder for the claim.
>
> Unfortunately, "requestor" or "recipient" can be confused with the
> "holder" because the holder must request a credential be issued to them
> from the issuer.
>
> >
> > On Mon, Feb 15, 2016 at 2:20 AM, Adrian Hope-Bailie
> > <adrian@hopebailie.com <mailto:adrian@hopebailie.com>> wrote:
> >
> >     Verifier seems appropriate given that these are "verifiable" claims
> >
> >     On 15 February 2016 at 00:59, Steven Rowat
> >     <steven_rowat@sunshine.net <mailto:steven_rowat@sunshine.net>>
> wrote:
> >
> >         On 2/14/16 1:44 PM, Manu Sporny wrote:
> >
> >             I'm happy with 'evaluators', but wonder what our colleagues
> >             in the
> >             education industry think? ...[snip]
> >
> >             Credential/Claim Requestor and Credential/Claim Verifier
> >             could also work?
> >
> >
> >         IMO any of Requestor, Verifier, or Evaluator would be preferable
> >         to Consumer.
> >
> >         Except, Requestor could be confused with 'holder', the
> >         person/entity asking for the original issuing, since at the
> >         start they are 'requesting' that a credential be issued for them
> >         -- which they then take elsewhere to be Evaluated or Verified
> >         (or, currently, Consumed).
> >
> >         But as you noted, with multiple possible systems in play --
> >         finance, education, payments, government -- it's going to be
> >         hard not to cause at least some confusion somewhere.
> >
> >
> >         Steven
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > -Shane
>
>
> --
> Dave Longley
> CTO
> Digital Bazaar, Inc.
>
>