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Re: Incorrect recommendation for dealing with List Elements in tagged PDF ( LC-2800)

From: <akirkpat@adobe.com>
Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2013 14:46:17 +0000
Message-Id: <E1VNkvR-0002Mc-FP@jessica.w3.org>
To: jonathanmetz@gmail.com
Cc: public-comments-wcag20@w3.org
 Dear jonathanmetz@gmail.com,

The Web Content Accessibility Guidelines Working Group has reviewed the
comments you sent [1] on the Last Call Working Draft [2] of the Techniques
for WCAG 2.0 published on 11 Jul 2013. Thank you for having taken the time
to review the document and to send us comments!

The Working Group's response to your comment is included below.

Please review it carefully and let us know by email at
public-comments-wcag20@w3.org if you agree with it or not before 2 Oct
2013. In case of disagreement, you are requested to provide a specific
solution for or a path to a consensus with the Working Group. If such a
consensus cannot be achieved, you will be given the opportunity to raise a
formal objection which will then be reviewed by the Director during the
transition of this document to the next stage in the W3C Recommendation


For the Web Content Accessibility Guidelines Working Group,
Michael Cooper
W3C Staff Contact

 1. http://www.w3.org/mid/E1V1dha-0001LE-E4@crusher.w3.org
 2. http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/2013/WD-WCAG20-TECHS-20130711/


Your comment on PDF21: Using List tags for lists in PDF documents:
> Name: Jonathan Metz
> Email: jonathanmetz@gmail.com
> Affiliation: User
> Document: TD
> Item Number: PDF21
> Part of Item: Examples
> Comment Type: technical
> Summary of Issue: Incorrect recommendation for dealing with List
> Elements in tagged PDF
> Comment (Including rationale for any proposed change):
> The page suggests that using the list button on the ribbon as the
> "easiest way to ensure that lists are formatted correctly when they are
> converted to PDF". It doesn't actually, since Word throws the label
> element in with the <Lbody> in the tag tree whenever one exports a list
> from Word. The user always has to edit those elements in the tag tree
> later. It even goes so far as to show screenshots of what happens when
> you do that. 
> It provides the List Elements at the beginning of the technique, but
> fails to show the relevant usage for implementing them. 
> It provides no information about dealing with unordered lists or how
> such labels for them are optional.
> It also does not clearly explain how a list is should appear properly
> structured.
> Proposed Change:
> 1. Show how lists are properly structured.
> 2. Explain which tags are optional for which list type (ordered must be
> labeled, unordered is optional) and which tags are mandatory.
> 3. Show how to properly adjust tags in PDF to create said list first
> without the use of proprietary means (i.e. from Word/InDesign/etc).
> 4. Change text from " the easiest way to ensure that lists are formatted
> correctly when they are converted to PDF" to "easiest way to ensure that
> THE BASIS for list STRUCTURE is formatted correctly when they are
> converted to PDF."
> 5. Provide examples for how to fix the incorrect placement of the tags
> after exporting from Word (as the example writer)

Working Group Resolution (LC-2800):
Thanks for the comment.  We understand that at this time PDF/UA requires
that lists are constructed with Lbl and LBody tags inside each LI tag, but
we also understand that current technologies do not distinguish between LI
tagged elements with this internal tag structure from those that do not. 
The changes that you propose are reasonable but given that  there is no
difference for the end user we will defer this work until there is a
difference.  If you are interested in contributing the changes you suggest
then the working group will be able to review that submission to be
included.  It is also worth noting that techniques assume that users are
familiar with the technology spec, and that the techniques contain a
reference to the PDF spec to provide more details for people who need them.

Received on Sunday, 22 September 2013 14:46:18 UTC

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