- From: Eric Eggert <eric@outline.rocks>
- Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2022 10:23:29 +0100
- To: Stefan Schumacher <stefan@duckflight.de>
- Cc: public-auth-trans-de@w3.org
- Message-ID: <B7C9CB39-E19A-4304-A362-C4DF26287B7F@outline.rocks>
On 24 Mar 2022, at 9:58, Stefan Schumacher wrote: > Hello Eric, > > Am 24.03.22 um 08:07 schrieb Eric Eggert: >> You can find the current translation guidelines for W3C Standards >> https://www.w3.org/Consortium/Translation/Overview.html > > I found the wrong link, because my search was too quick, and I didn't > look at the documents for a long time. Thanks for correcting me. > > >> Among these guidelines, it states: >> >> **Do not change or adapt or add to the meaning of the English >> version in your translation.** If you have suggestions for >> changes >> to the English version, provide them to the technical report >> editors >> as indicated in *Status of this Document section** of the >> technical >> report. > > Indeed you have to translate even errors that have an errata, so that > the translation shows the error. Errata can be fixed in translations and we have done so for WCAG 2.1 (like the German WCAG 2.0 translation did for WCAG 2.0). > That does not mean that you cannot add an annotation, that points the > reader to the errata and explains the errata. > > >> I do not find any information on how to add translation notes inside >> the normative text. (But this might be under-documented.) > > > If you follow this link > https://www.w3.org/Consortium/Legal/IPR-FAQ-20000620#translate > you will find the section: > May I annotate one of your specifications? > > Here it says that you can annotate specifications if you follow the > described procedure. Indeed the documents are old, but still valid as > far as I can see. This is about annotations for specifications, not necessarily about Authorized Translations. > As an example for annotated translations you can refer to the German > translations of various documents, e.g. HTML 4.01. I found this translation of HTML4.01 which is **not** Authorized, and also not a finalized document: http://www.edition-w3.de/TR/1999/REC-html401-19991224/ > A short example can be found here: > http://www.schumacher-netz.de/TR/2013/REC-html-rdfa-20130822.de.html This is also not an Authorized Translation of the specification (and also self-referential). > In the header it is stated that the document contains annotations. > Within the document there is a clearly marked section "Kommentar des > Übersetzer" with a different background color, the same color that is > used for the translation header. > > >> That said, the WCAG 2.0 translation has an “Anmerkungen” section >> in the top disclaimer area, and links to a separate “Anmerkungen >> zur deutschen Übersetzung der WCAG 2.0” page. >> (https://www.w3.org/Translations/WCAG20-de/anmerkungen.html >> <https://www.w3.org/Translations/WCAG20-de/anmerkungen.html> ) > > I have seen that approach, imho, a good way to list the comments in > the document. But keeping the comments in place were misunderstandings > could occur is more helpful than only showing these "Anmerkungen" at > the bottom. Readers search for specific sections, read them and leave. > So the "Anmerkungen" will not be read in most cases. It might be a better way, but it also adds interpretation to the specification that is not in the original. I would rather press for clarifications in the original. Skimming several WCAG 2.1 translations, I could not find translator notes in any of them. https://www.w3.org/Translations/#s-WCAG21 I can reach out to my contacts at W3C and see if there is a way. 👋 Eric > > Just my two cent > STS > > > > >> >> I think adding a note about the wording in a similar place/document >> for WCAG 2.1 might help to clarify the issue. I wonder if that could >> ease the concerns raised by Gottfried Zimmermann. >> >> 👋 Eric >> >> On 23 Mar 2022, at 22:22, Stefan Schumacher wrote: >> >> Hello editors and translators, >> >> Am 23.03.22 um 09:48 schrieb Eric Eggert: >> >> The translation of assistive technology as “assistierende >> Techniken” was a WCAG 2.0 translation consensus reached as >> German speaking countries have different names. The >> discussion >> only refers to sources in Germany for the impetus of the >> change >> request where “assistive Technologien” is prevalent. >> >> in the past we used to add a "comment of the translator(s)" in a >> box >> that was clearly marked as a comment of the translator(s). >> >> Adding these comments helps readers to understand why translators >> used terms that, e.g., might be not up to date anymore. >> >> A comment why the term "assistierende Techniken" is used and that >> it >> might be referred to as "Assistive Techniken" or "Assistive >> Technologien" in other sources and why this decision was made, >> would >> help in this case. >> >> Adding these comments is fine with W3C as you can see in >> https://www.w3.org/International/2004/06/translation-process >> <https://www.w3.org/International/2004/06/translation-process> . >> See "Changes to the text". >> Please correct me if that is not true for authorized >> translations. >> >> I would say a good translation should have these comments in >> place >> where a precise translation is not possible, where multiple terms >> might be right, and in case there are already Errata that correct >> the original version. >> >> Regards >> Stefan Schumacher >> >> PS. When I translated WCAG 2.1 end of 2018 up to chapter 1.4 >> without >> looking at WCAG 2.0 I used "assistierende Technologie". Even >> though >> I prefer "Technologie" over "Technik" myself, I would not deem it >> a >> reason for a general disapproval. >> >> >> -- >> >> outline Consulting >> >> Sandra Kallmeyer und Eric Eggert GbR >> Gutenbergstr. 12 >> 57537 Wissen >> GERMANY >> >> USt-IdNr.: DE275406670 >> >> info@outline.rocks >> www.outline.rocks >> >> Spielregeln >> http://outline.rocks/spielregeln.php >> <http://outline.rocks/spielregeln.php> >> -- outline Consulting Sandra Kallmeyer und Eric Eggert GbR Gutenbergstr. 12 57537 Wissen GERMANY USt-IdNr.: DE275406670 info@outline.rocks www.outline.rocks Spielregeln http://outline.rocks/spielregeln.php
Received on Thursday, 24 March 2022 09:25:06 UTC