Re: Accname question regarding self-references

We can try some rule changes in Blink if they are simple enough to
implement, to see what else breaks in Chrome's automated tests.
However, some rules tweaks are simpler than others.


On Wed, Jan 6, 2021 at 1:39 PM James Nurthen <nurthen@adobe.com> wrote:

> Bryan – can you clarify that you still expect example 2 in the Accname
> spec to work correctly?
>
>
>
> The following example shows the interaction of aria-labelledby and
> aria-label when a node has an aria-labelledby that refers to itself. The
> <span role="button"> elements have the accessible names "Delete
> Documentation.pdf" and "Delete HolidayLetter.pdf", respectively.
>
>
>
> EXAMPLE 2
>
> <h1>Files</h1>
>
> <ul>
>
>   <li>
>
>     <a id="file_row1"
> href="./files/Documentation.pdf">Documentation.pdf</a>
>
>     <span role="button" tabindex="0" id="del_row1" aria-label="Delete"
> aria-labelledby="del_row1 file_row1"></span>
>
>   </li>
>
>   <li>
>
>     <a id="file_row2"
> href="./files/HolidayLetter.pdf">HolidayLetter.pdf</a>
>
>     <span role="button" tabindex="0" id="del_row2" aria-label="Delete"
> aria-labelledby="del_row2 file_row2"></span>
>
>   </li>
>
> </ul>
>
>
>
> *James Nurthen (he/him)*  |  *Accessibility Engineer*  |  *Adobe*  |  T 415
> 832 2734 <(415)%20832-2734>  |  nurthen@adobe.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From: *Bryan Garaventa <bryan.garaventa@levelaccess.com>
> *Date: *Wednesday, January 6, 2021 at 10:31 AM
> *To: *Carolyn MacLeod <Carolyn_MacLeod@ca.ibm.com>, "public-aria@w3.org" <
> public-aria@w3.org>
> *Subject: *RE: Accname question regarding self-references
> *Resent-From: *<public-aria@w3.org>
> *Resent-Date: *Wednesday, January 6, 2021 at 10:31 AM
>
>
>
> “where a component needs to augment an input's label with invisible text?”
>
>
>
> What about the following?
>
>
>
> <span id="nameId">Visible Name</span>
>
> <input aria-labelledby="nameId" aria-description="Invisible Description"
> type="text">
>
>
>
> Doesn’t this already do that?
>
>
>
>
>
> Bryan Garaventa
>
> Principal Accessibility Architect
>
> Level Access, Inc.
>
> Bryan.Garaventa@LevelAccess.com
>
> 415.624.2709 <(415)%20624-2709> (o)
>
> www.LevelAccess.com <http://www.levelaccess.com/>
>
>
>
> *From:* Carolyn MacLeod <Carolyn_MacLeod@ca.ibm.com>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 6, 2021 9:05 AM
> *To:* public-aria@w3.org
> *Subject:* RE: Accname question regarding self-references
>
>
>
> *CAUTION:* This email originated from outside of the organization. Do not
> click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know
> the content is safe.
>
>
>
> How could an author achieve this without either using the visually-hidden
> hack, or invalid "aria-label on span" code that happens to still work?
>
>
>
> Here are 2 possible "work-arounds" that I tried, but I can't think of any
> others (could easily be missing something):
>
> https://carmacleod.github.io/playground/self-ref-aria-label.html?ver=1
>
>
>
> The work-arounds achieve the goal (accessible name is "The Label
> ariaLabel" in Chrome, Edge, Firefox, and Safari), but they are not very
> elegant work-arounds, and they necessarily involve growing another element
> to "solve" the "problem".
>
>
>
> James, can you describe a concrete example (or two) where a component
> needs to augment an input's label with invisible text? I'm guessing there
> must be many, but I think 2 compelling concrete examples would be useful
> here.
>
>
>
> Car
>
>
>
> ----- Original message -----
> From: "Carolyn MacLeod" <Carolyn_MacLeod@ca.ibm.com>
> To: public-aria@w3.org
> Cc: faulkner.steve@gmail.com, nurthen@adobe.com
> Subject: [EXTERNAL] RE: Accname question regarding self-references
> Date: Wed, Jan 6, 2021 10:13 AM
>
>
>
> Steve,
>
>
>
> > link to the issue?
>
>
>
> Seems to be this one:
> https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=1159567
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__bugs.chromium.org_p_chromium_issues_detail-3Fid-3D1159567&d=DwMGaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=7pxjQj6Sn7GadcQXUI8qdHzQ7owon0mR-h863iCnxZc&m=mbz1_iU8T6MdlVHlwCsQ2yWfa6mLMjMBLLUcYDOCTk0&s=cDpvq2wEj5DbZQRgNKm35iyXFl-JlRhECRq808QeLmQ&e=>
>
>
>
> Car
>
> ----- Original message -----
> From: David MacDonald <david@can-adapt.com>
> To: Steve Faulkner <faulkner.steve@gmail.com>
> Cc: James Nurthen <nurthen@adobe.com>, ARIA Working Group <
> public-aria@w3.org>
> Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: Accname question regarding self-references
> Date: Wed, Jan 6, 2021 7:15 AM
>
>
>
> I would say A
>
>
>
> ACCNAME would be
>
>
>
> "The Label AriaLabel"
>
>
>
> I'm sorry I've looked at this sentence 3 times and am scratching my head.
>
>
>
> "the self-reference is ignored because the root node has already been
> processed when it was also the ‘current node’."
>
>
>
> Cheers,
> David MacDonald
>
>
>
> *Can**Adapt* *Solutions Inc.*
>
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>
>
> On Wed, Jan 6, 2021 at 3:57 AM Steve Faulkner <faulkner.steve@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> We are having a debate in a Chrome issue about the following.
>
>
>
> link to the issue?
>
> --
>
> Regards
>
> SteveF
>
> Accessibility is political
>
> Working for the web
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__twitter.com_stevefaulkner_status_940835584410574850&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=7pxjQj6Sn7GadcQXUI8qdHzQ7owon0mR-h863iCnxZc&m=NBN9ZCXTg3LP6bawS00P8ksp6RnPK87Tn7pCznIOfBI&s=skSjY7FkAQQkU5A5LkwvmYX0KNxRRLByEP5bUEzg-VM&e=>
> ,
>
> anywhere and everywhere
>
>
>
> On Tue, 5 Jan 2021 at 01:30, James Nurthen <nurthen@adobe.com> wrote:
>
> We are having a debate in a Chrome issue about the following.
>
>
>
> According to the accessible name algorithm what should be the accessible
> name of the input in the below
>
>
>
> <span id="label">The Label</span>
>
> <input id="input" aria-label="ariaLabel" aria-labelledby="label input"
> value="the value">
>
>
>
> Choices
>
>    1. “The label ariaLabel”
>    2. “The label the value”
>    3. “The label ariaLabel the value”
>    4. Something else…
>
>
>
>
>
> *James Nurthen (he/him)*
> *Accessibility engineer*
>
> T 415 832 2734 <(415)%20832-2734>
> nurthen@adobe.com
>
> [image: Adobe]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>