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RE: [nvda] NVDA incorrectly announces the presence of empty Alert live regions when dynamically added to the DOM (#5657)

From: Bryan Garaventa <bryan.garaventa@ssbbartgroup.com>
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2016 23:17:07 +0000
To: Michiel Bijl <michiel@agosto.nl>
CC: ARIA Working Group <public-aria@w3.org>
Message-ID: <SN1PR0301MB19814FA94B631AF42B23439898F50@SN1PR0301MB1981.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>
No problem, if I sound annoyed it’s not you, it’s the idea that I have to recode a framework just because of what appears to me to be a misinterpretation of the spec by one AT.


From: Michiel Bijl [mailto:michiel@agosto.nl]
Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2016 2:19 PM
To: Bryan Garaventa <bryan.garaventa@ssbbartgroup.com>
Cc: ARIA Working Group <public-aria@w3.org>
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA incorrectly announces the presence of empty Alert live regions when dynamically added to the DOM (#5657)

Maybe I misunderstood. My suggestion was in case we needed to clarify the spec. I think it is obvious that a browser/AT should not fire an alert or notification if there is no content. And if NVDA does it, that is an NVDA bug.

—Michiel

On 07 Jan 2016, at 19:49, Bryan Garaventa <bryan.garaventa@ssbbartgroup.com<mailto:bryan.garaventa@ssbbartgroup.com>> wrote:

Who are we asking to change? All browsers that fire this event? Or just one screen reader that announces it when it has no content?

I don’t think the spec is wrong, it’s up to the AT to announce something using the event, and it’s only NVDA that is doing this.

From: Michiel Bijl [mailto:michiel@agosto.nl]
Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2016 8:13 AM
To: Bryan Garaventa <bryan.garaventa@ssbbartgroup.com<mailto:bryan.garaventa@ssbbartgroup.com>>
Cc: ARIA Working Group <public-aria@w3.org<mailto:public-aria@w3.org>>
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA incorrectly announces the presence of empty Alert live regions when dynamically added to the DOM (#5657)

If this indeed the case, appending “and has content” or “except when it is void of content” to the first paragraph would suffice if you ask me.

—Michiel

On 07 Jan 2016, at 16:50, Bryan Garaventa <bryan.garaventa@ssbbartgroup.com<mailto:bryan.garaventa@ssbbartgroup.com>> wrote:
Is this right? That doesn’t sound right to me.

From: James Teh [mailto:notifications@github.com]
Sent: Wednesday, January 06, 2016 4:14 PM
To: nvaccess/nvda <nvda@noreply.github.com<mailto:nvda@noreply.github.com>>
Cc: Bryan Garaventa <bryan.garaventa@whatsock.com<mailto:bryan.garaventa@whatsock.com>>
Subject: Re: [nvda] NVDA incorrectly announces the presence of empty Alert live regions when dynamically added to the DOM (#5657)

role="alert" gets treated somewhat differently to normal live regions. As noted in the spec:
If the operating system allows, the user agent SHOULD fire a system alert event through the accessibility API when the WAI-ARIA alert is created.
Firefox does fire such an event, regardless of whether there is content in the alert. According to the above, this is not contrary to the spec. NVDA responds accordingly by reporting the alert.
It's true that obviously nothing could be announced for an empty live region (since live region announcements are just the text). However, an alert is special in that it reports "alert" as well.
I'd probably agree that this isn't useful behaviour, but if changing this is desired, it'll need to be addressed in the spec and then the browsers.
—
Reply to this email directly or view it on GitHub<https://github.com/nvaccess/nvda/issues/5657#issuecomment-169505571>.

Received on Thursday, 7 January 2016 23:17:40 UTC

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