Re: [Accessibility-ia2] IA2 Role Landmark

Hi Rich,


I understand the reason for the use of the landmark role for 
role="form". However, I disagree with the HTML form element being mapped 
to the landmark role because semantics are lost. The fact that something 
is a form has more semantic value than just being a landmark. Still, if 
the spec already requires this, I guess we have little choice but to 
comply at this stage.


Jamie

On 25/08/2016 3:08 AM, Rich Schwerdtfeger wrote:
> Jamie,
>
> The point is we want ALL the landmarks to be treated the same way for 
> ATVs. So, first we determine that it is a landmark. Then we go to 
> xml-roles to determine the type of landmark.
>
> Otherwise, we need a special case for a form. That is what we are 
> trying to avoid. For these reasons ATK/ATSPI created a landmark role 
> first.
>
> The HTML the form element now uses the ARIA mappings for the form 
> role. See "Use WAI-ARIA mapping” under the form element. This is for 
> all platforms.
>
> https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/html-aam/html-aam.html
>
> We do understand that non-browser applications may still use the older 
> Form role mapping as would older browser versions. It is for these 
> reasons that our definition of deprecation is that it has not gone a 
> way but rather it is going to this new preferred mapping.
>
> Best,
>
> Rich
>
>
>
> Rich Schwerdtfeger
>
>
>
>
>> On Aug 23, 2016, at 7:35 PM, James Teh <jamie@nvaccess.org 
>> <mailto:jamie@nvaccess.org>> wrote:
>>
>> If you believe that role="form" has no semantic value other than 
>> being a landmark, then let's go ahead and map it to 
>> IA2_ROLE_LANDMARK. On the other hand, the HTML form tag *does* have 
>> semantic value other than being a landmark, so I'd argue it should be 
>> IA2_ROLE_FORM.
>>
>>
>> On 24/08/2016 5:22 AM, Rich Schwerdtfeger wrote:
>>> We are not asking that IA2_ROLE_FORM be deprecated altogether. Even 
>>> with ARIA we have some attributes that re deprecated but that is 
>>> meant so that there will be a replacement solution. An example is 
>>> the drag and drop aria properties. For ARIA browser conformance 
>>> testing to exit Candidate Recommendation we will be testing for 
>>> IA2_ROLE_LANDMARK on form roles.
>>>
>>> Rich Schwerdtfeger
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Aug 18, 2016, at 9:56 PM, James Teh <jamie@nvaccess.org 
>>>> <mailto:jamie@nvaccess.org>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On 11/08/2016 2:58 AM, Alexander Surkov wrote:
>>>>> 1) adding IA2_ROLE_LANDMARK and
>>>> Yes.
>>>>
>>>>> 2) deprecating IA2_ROLE_FORM?
>>>> I'd argue that there is more semantic value in a "form" than just 
>>>> the fact that it is a landmark. This probably doesn't apply to ARIA 
>>>> (at least for now), since role="form" is defined as only a 
>>>> landmark. However, I'd argue it does apply to the HTML form tag. 
>>>> So, I'm fine t not use IA2_ROLE_FORM for ARIA role="form", but I'm 
>>>> dubious about deprecating it altogether, including for the HTML 
>>>> form tag.
>>>> Jamie
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> James Teh
>>>> Executive Director, NV Access Limited
>>>> Ph +61 7 3149 3306
>>>> www.nvaccess.org <http://www.nvaccess.org/>
>>>> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
>>>> Twitter: @NVAccess
>>>> SIP: jamie@nvaccess.org
>>>>
>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> James Teh
>> Executive Director, NV Access Limited
>> Ph +61 7 3149 3306
>> www.nvaccess.org
>> Facebook:http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
>> Twitter: @NVAccess
>> SIP:jamie@nvaccess.org
>

-- 
James Teh
Executive Director, NV Access Limited
Ph +61 7 3149 3306
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess
SIP: jamie@nvaccess.org