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Re: [xml-dev] Serialization of XDM - Use cases / Proposal

From: David A. Lee <dlee@calldei.com>
Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 14:14:39 -0400
Message-ID: <4AB51F8F.3030809@calldei.com>
To: Jim Tivy <jimt@bluestream.com>
CC: xml-dev@lists.xml.org, "'XProc Dev'" <xproc-dev@w3.org>
I am reading this the same way as you.  The use of the <doc> element and 
reference to an external entity are used as a way to describe
that the elements are simply text concatenated.
Atleast thats how I read it.  


Jim Tivy wrote:
>
> Yes, from http://www.w3.org/TR/xslt-xquery-serialization I think my 
> use case is handled by producing a serialization of an "external 
> general parsed entity" which can have (element)* in a form such as:
>
>  
>
> <div>
>
> </div>
>
> <div>
>
> </div>
>
>  
>
> There is some confusing text, however in 5. XML Output Method where it 
> describes the "reconstructed tree" as different from the result tree:
>
>  
>
> "if the document was produced by adding a document wrapper, as 
> described above, then it will contain an extra |doc| element as the 
> document element."
>
>  
>
> I did not see in the spec where adding a <doc> tag was part of 
> serialization - rather it was just shown as a way of describing the 
> use of an external general parsed entity.
>
>  
>
> Jim
>
>  
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> *From:* David A. Lee [mailto:dlee@calldei.com]
> *Sent:* Friday, September 18, 2009 6:21 PM
> *To:* Jim Tivy
> *Cc:* xml-dev@lists.xml.org; 'XProc Dev'
> *Subject:* Re: [xml-dev] Serialization of XDM - Use cases / Proposal
>
>  
>
> This spec describes concatenation of node sequences such that they are 
> parseable as entities.
>
> In the case you describe I think that fits well.
> Atleast in my reading
>
>
>     *5 XML Output Method*
>
> This describes serializing a sequence of nodes.  I think this spec 
> would fit for your use case.
> Atleast that is my read, I admit I have a hard time following the 
> reading of this spec (not to blame the authors, I just have a hard 
> time understanding it all)
>
>
>
> David A. Lee
> dlee@calldei.com <mailto:dlee@calldei.com>  
> http://www.calldei.com
> http://www.xmlsh.org
> 812-482-5224
>
>
>
> Jim Tivy wrote:
>
> David
>  
> I do not see in this spec where it defines the serialization of a sequence.
> I was not talking about concatenating "nodes" but rather concatenation of
> text from a sequence after it was serialized.
>  
> Jim
>  
> -----Original Message-----
> From: David A. Lee [mailto:dlee@calldei.com] 
> Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 4:46 PM
> To: Jim Tivy
> Cc: xml-dev@lists.xml.org <mailto:xml-dev@lists.xml.org>; 'XProc Dev'
> Subject: Re: [xml-dev] Serialization of XDM - Use cases / Proposal
>  
> This is a case, if I'm reading it properly, where the current XDM 
> Serializaiton spec may serve perfectly.
> http://www.w3.org/TR/xslt-xquery-serialization/
>  
> That would concatenate the result nodes such that it is serialized 
> equivalently to an external entity.
>  
>  
>  
> David A. Lee
> dlee@calldei.com <mailto:dlee@calldei.com>  
> http://www.calldei.com
> http://www.xmlsh.org
> 812-482-5224
>  
>  
>  
> Jim Tivy wrote:
>   
>> Here is a better description of the use case I have:
>>  
>> There are a number "templating" technologies in use for defining web
>>     
> pages;
>   
>> for example PHP, ASP and JSP.  These templating languages have been very
>> successful.  When these templates "execute", they produce an HTML page as
>>     
> an
>   
>> HTTP response.  These templating technologies allow you to mix html tags
>> with program logic to create web pages dynamically.  These templating
>> languages, as a rule, are text based in that they define a page by
>> concatenating HTML chunks of text together.  For example, in a JSP file,
>> sometimes these HTML chunks are literal text and other times they are
>> calculated and "injected inline" into the output - always as text.
>>  
>> It should be possible to inject an XDM text serialization (a sequence of
>> <div> tags and children, for instance) as returned by
>> getPipelineSerialization () call in this simple JSP page shown below: 
>>  
>> <html>
>>    <body>
>>       <% out.write(getPipelineSerialization("mypipeline")); %>
>>    </body>
>> </html>
>>  
>> examples of jsps:
>>  
>> http://java.sun.com/products/jsp/html/jspbasics.fm.html
>>  
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Jim Tivy [mailto:jimt@bluestream.com] 
>> Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 3:12 PM
>> To: 'David A. Lee'
>> Cc: xml-dev@lists.xml.org <mailto:xml-dev@lists.xml.org>; talk@x-query.com <mailto:talk@x-query.com>; 'XProc Dev'
>> Subject: RE: [xml-dev] Serialization of XDM - Use cases / Proposal
>>  
>> Hi David
>>  
>> We use XDM serialization - for a simple sequence.  We have a pipeline that
>> we execute and the last node is XPath /html/body/* of an upstream html
>> document - we call it html core output.  We use this in JSP (java server
>> pages) code where we wish to establish the css files and meta tags but
>>     
> serve
>   
>> up the html content from the pipeline.
>>  
>> If you like I can write this up in your wiki.
>>  
>> Jim
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: David A. Lee [mailto:dlee@calldei.com] 
>> Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 2:07 PM
>> Cc: xml-dev@lists.xml.org <mailto:xml-dev@lists.xml.org>; talk@x-query.com <mailto:talk@x-query.com>; XProc Dev
>> Subject: Re: [xml-dev] Serialization of XDM - Use cases / Proposal
>>  
>> I have created a first pass at documenting the problem of XDM 
>> Serialization and created some use cases.
>> I would love any feedback or comments.  This is on a new wiki I created 
>> for this purpose.  If you would like to comment directly on the wiki 
>> please reply to me and I will give you the invite code (due to the sad 
>> state of affairs anonymous comments and editing are disabled due to 
>> wiki-spam-bots.  I've found spam within 5 minutes of opening a public 
>> wiki ... <sigh> )
>>  
>>  
>> http://xml.calldei.com/XDMSerialize
>>  
>> I have NOT included a proposal for a format yet, I'd like to discuss the 
>> intent and use cases first before putting up a straw-man proposal.
>>  
>> Thank you for any contribution !
>>  
>> I've CC'd this to xproc-dev because one of the use cases if for 
>> developers and integrators with XML Pipeline processors such as XProc
>>  
>>  
>> David A. Lee
>> dlee@calldei.com <mailto:dlee@calldei.com>  
>> http://www.calldei.com
>> http://www.xmlsh.org
>> 812-482-5224
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
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Received on Saturday, 19 September 2009 18:15:42 GMT

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