W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > www-webont-wg@w3.org > August 2003

WOWG: proposed minutes for 7 August

From: Peter F. Patel-Schneider <pfps@research.bell-labs.com>
Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2003 13:54:44 -0400 (EDT)
Message-Id: <20030807.135444.07267067.pfps@research.bell-labs.com>
To: schreiber@cs.vu.nl
Cc: www-webont-wg@w3.org

PROPOSED MINUTES  Teleconference Web Ontology Working Group  7 August 2003

Continued and new ACTIONS

ACTION: Peter Patel-Schneider: to look over Jeremy's B1 B2 proof
	revision.

ACTION: Guus Schreiber: to reply to Dave Reynolds saying we have added the
	above [B1 B2] to the "at risk["] list.

ACTION: Deborah McGuinness, Mike Smith, Mike Dean, Peter Patel-Schneider,
	Jos de Roo: fix all links and references to other OWL documents
	to point to 18 August CR versions
	(subsequently modified so that links in the text of non-normative
	documents can be to the latest version instead)


Edited IRC Log follows at bottom.

Minutes

* AGENDA  Teleconference Web Ontology Working Group
* Aug 7, 2003, 1200 (East US), 0900 (West US). 1700 (London)
* Duration: 60-90 min
* 
* Bridge: +1.617.761.6200 passcode 9326#.
* IRC Chat: irc:irc.w3.org (port 6665), #webont
* 
* Chair: Guus Schreiber
* Scribe: [Peter F. Patel-Schneider]
* 
* 
* 1. ADMINISTRIVIA
* 
* Rol[l] Call
* 
* Regrets:
* Jeremy Carroll, Herman ter Horst, Evan Wallace, Charles White

Present: Sandro, Jeff Heflin, Mike Smith, Peter Patel-Schneider,
Ian_Horrocks, Dan Connolly, Deborah McGuinness, Marwan Sabbouh, Sean
Bechhofer, Mike Dean, Chris Welty, Guus Schreiber

* Approve Minutes of Jul 24:
* http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Jul/0313.html
* plus amendment by Connolly:
* http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Aug/0004.html

Approved without the amendment.

* Telecon schedule:
* 
* Aug 14    NO telecon
* Aug 21    telecon, chair Hendler, scribe TBD


* 2. ACTION ITEM REVIEW
* 
* ACTION Ian to draft a response for Dave Reynolds on the issue of named
* dataranges, discussing the danger of uncomfortable interactions between
* datatypes and such dataranges.
* DONE:
* http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webont-comments/2003Jul/0053.html
* 
* ACTION Jeremy to produce 4 or 5 new test cases for structure sharing
* checking
* DONE:
* http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Jul/0317.html
* 
* ACTION Peter Patel-Schneider to look over Jeremy's B1 B2 proof
* revision.

CONTINUED

* ACTION Jim Hendler to change CR request to indicate risk for
* syntax constraint on structure sharing
* DONE:
* http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Jul/0342.html
* 
* ACTION Jim Hendler to reply to Dave Reynolds saying we have added the
* above to the "at risk list.

TRANSFERRED to Guus.

* ACTION Jeremy Carroll to review Wine and Food ontologies from
* Guide.
* DONE:
* http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Jul/0306.html
* 
* ACTION? Jeremy Carroll to review recent language layering changes to S
* and AS.
* DONE:
* http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Jul/0296.html
* 
* 
* 3. STATUS CR REQUEST
* http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/WebOnt/rqim.html
* 
* - short update by team contacts / chairs on time line

Target date for CR is 18 August, but there are lots of risks still, due to
people-scheduling issues.  Press release is possible and now somewhat
likely. 

Extra CR exit conditions that come out of W3C will be shown to Guus who
will determine if they are acceptable to the working group.


* 4. STATUS CR DOCUMENTS
* 
* 3.1 General issues
* 
* - CR date

Tentatively 18 August 2003.

* - cross references to other OWL documents
* See message from Mike Smith:
* http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Aug/0009.html

Documents MUST link to date-specific versions of other documents.

ACTION: Deborah McGuinness, Mike Smith, Mike Dean, Peter Patel-Schneider,
	Jos de Roo: fix all links and references to other OWL documents
	to point to 18 August CR versions
	(subsequently modified so that links in the text of non-normative
	documents can be to the latest version instead)

[From Mike Smith:

	Change all [pointers] to match:

	http://www.w3.org/TR/2003/CR-owl-features-20030818/ 
	http://www.w3.org/TR/2003/CR-owl-guide-20030818/ 
	http://www.w3.org/TR/2003/CR-owl-ref-20030818/ 
	http://www.w3.org/TR/2003/CR-owl-semantics-20030818/ 
	http://www.w3.org/TR/2003/CR-owl-test-20030818/ 
	http://www.w3.org/TR/2003/CR-webont-req-20030818/ 

	Change citations to incorporate the above and modify 
	status and published date to

	 W3C Candidate Recommendation 18 August 2003


My updated OWL reference list is as follows:


<dt><a id="ref-guide">[OWL Guide]</a></dt>
<dd>
<cite><a href="http://www.w3.org/TR/2003/CR-owl-guide-20030818/">OWL Web
Ontology Language Guide</a></cite>. 
Michael K. Smith, and Chris Welty, and Deborah L. McGuinness.
W3C Candidate Recommendation 18 August 2003.
Latest version is available at 
<a href="http://www.w3.org/TR/owl-guide/">http://www.w3.org/TR/owl-guide/</a>. 
</dd>

<dt><a id="ref-issues">[OWL Issues]</a></dt>
<dd>
<cite><a href="http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/WebOnt/webont-issues.html">
Web Ontology Issue Status</a></cite>.
Michael K. Smith, ed.
27 June 2003.
</dd>

<dt><a id="ref-overview">[OWL Overview]</a></dt>
<dd>
<cite><a href="http://www.w3.org/TR/2003/CR-owl-features-20030818/">OWL Web
Ontology Language Overview</a></cite>. 
Deborah L. McGuinness and Frank van Harmelen.
W3C Candidate Recommendation 18 August 2003.
Latest version is available at 
<a href="http://www.w3.org/TR/owl-features/">http://www.w3.org/TR/owl-features/</a>.
</dd>

<dt><a id="ref-ref">[OWL Reference]</a></dt>
<dd>
<cite><a href="http://www.w3.org/TR/2003/CR-owl-ref-20030818/">OWL Web
Ontology Language Reference</a></cite>. 
Mike Dean, Guus Schreiber, Sean Bechhofer, Frank van Harmelen, Jim Hendler,
Ian Horrocks, 
Deborah L. McGuinness, Peter F. Patel-Schneider, and Lynn Andrea Stein.
W3C Candidate Recommendation 18 August 2003.
Latest version is available at
<a href="http://www.w3.org/TR/owl-ref/">http://www.w3.org/TR/owl-ref/</a>.
</dd>




* - cross references to RDF documents

Need to point to real versions, which are the last-call versions.
If desirable, could also point to editor's draft.
Whereever the OWL document depends on post-last-call changes this should be
so indicated.

- other changes

Change lists should be kept, but could be purged of typo changes, etc.

Each document editor will send email to the working group when their final
version is available at the usual place.  They will notify Dan Connolly by
sending mail to connolly+pager@w3.org if they cannot meet their target
completion time (given below).

Acknowledgment sections should include the three new members:
Charles White, Natasha Kravtsova, [and some other which I can't determine].
Note: My version was missng Jeremy Carroll, Dan Connolly, and 
	Jonathan Dale I don't think that any of these are the missing
	member. 

* 4.2 Document-specific
* 
* ACTION WD editors to prepare drafts for CR
*    Overview: Sandro
*    Guide: Mike S.
*    Reference: Mike D.
*    S&AS: Peter
*    Test: Jeremy/Jos
*    Requirements: Sandro/Jeff

Note: This action was not accepted at the last telecon.

* - OWL Overview
* 
* ACTION:
* Sandro to see that changes are completed in Overview addressing QA
* issues (specifically: complete document roadmap).

Deborah McGuinness will point to requirements doc and make other changes by
8 August. 

* - OWL Guide
* 
* Question from Mike Smith: "DOCTYPE owl"
* http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Aug/0011.html

DOCTYPE has been fixed.  Pointers to food and wine ontologies will be
fixed.  Mike Smith will be done by noon on 8 August.

* - OWL Reference
* 
* ACTIONS:
*     - change regarding the absence of daml:item
*     - dc date out of date
*     - Jos will look over owl.owl (not in critical path)
* 
* Question from Guus: owl.owl or owl.rdf
* http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Aug/0003.html

No changes to owl.  It will be referred to as owl (without the extension)
and stored as owl.rdf (as it is an RDF document).    Guus will be done by
noon on 8 August.

* - OWL S&AS
* 
* Peter no reported: no pending changes
* http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Aug/0007.html

Peter will be done by noon on 8 August.

* - OWL Test
* 
*  From Jul 24 minutes:
*     - changes will continue until PR status)
*     - Jos found the number of tests not yet recommended too great, but
*       we could not fix this on the telecon.
*     - XML literal with language tags still needs to be done.

All changes have been made.  Test will be changing as new tests are
designed and approved.  Jos will be done by 8 August.

* - OWL Use Cases and Requirements
* 
*  From Jul 24 minutes:
*     - old, misleading date on editor's draft noted.

Jeff will be done tomorrow.

* 5. AOB

Dan Connolly needs to be notified if the documents will not be ready on
time.  See above for more details.


ADJOURN.




Log


Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	+Ian_Horrocks
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	+ +1.514.878.aaaa
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	+Deb_Mcguinness
DanC_jam <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/danc_jam,isnick> 	Zakim, aaaa is DanC
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	+DanC; got it
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	+Marwan_Sabbouh
DanC_jam <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/danc_jam,isnick> 	agenda?
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	sees 1 item remaining on the 
agenda:
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	1. 7Aug 
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Aug/0018.html 
<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Aug/0018.html> 
[from DanC_jam]
-->| 	DeborahMc (dlm@171.66.176.245 <mailto:dlm@171.66.176.245>) has 
joined #webont <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/%23webont>
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	+??P16
guus <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/guus,isnick> 	zakim, pick a scibe
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	I don't understand 'pick a 
scibe', guus
sandro <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/sandro,isnick> 	RRSAgent, poitner?
RRSAgent <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/rrsagent,isnick> 	I'm logging. Sorry, 
nothing found for 'poitner'
DanC_jam <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/danc_jam,isnick> 	Zakim, pick a scribe
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	Not knowing who is chairing 
or who scribed recently, I propose ??P16
sandro <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/sandro,isnick> 	zakim, ??P16 is Sean
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	+Sean; got it
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	+Mike_Dean
pfps 	zakim, pfps is pfps-scribe
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	sorry, pfps, I do not 
recognize a party named 'pfps'
=-= 	danc_jam has changed the topic to "7Aug 
http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/WebOnt/ <http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/WebOnt/> ; 
chair: guus. scribe: PFPS"
sandro <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/sandro,isnick> 	zakim, who is here?
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	On the phone I see GuusS, 
Sandro, Jeff_Heflin, [EDS], Peter_PS, Ian_Horrocks, DanC, 
Deb_Mcguinness, Marwan_Sabbouh, Sean, Mike_Dean
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	On IRC I see DeborahMc, 
pfps, IanH, seanb, sandro, RRSAgent, Zakim, DanC_jam, guus, logger
pfps 	zakim, pfps is pfps_scribe
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	sorry, pfps, I do not 
recognize a party named 'pfps'
DanC_jam <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/danc_jam,isnick> 	wonders if pfps means: 
/nick pfps_scribe
sandro <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/sandro,isnick> 	or maybe: zakim, Peter_PS 
is pfps_scribe
pfps 	Roll call, see above and regrets
pfps 	1. Administration
pfps 	Approve minutes (without amendment) - approved
pfps 	2. Action Item Review
pfps 	(request for meeting next week of editors if any is needed) - most 
editors available (not Mike Dean)
pfps 	ACTION Ian to draft a response for Dave Reynolds on the issue of 
named
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	+[IBM]
-->| 	ChrisW (welty@129.34.20.16 <mailto:welty@129.34.20.16>) has joined 
#webont <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/%23webont>
pfps 	Action Ian - DONE
pfps 	Action Jeremy - DONE
pfps 	Action Peter - continued
pfps 	Action Jim - taken over by Guus
pfps 	Action Jeremy - DONE
pfps 	Action Jeremy - DONE
pfps 	3. STATUS CR REQUEST
pfps 	DanC - targetting 18 August for CR
pfps 	DanC - lots of risks, because lots of schedules need to be impacted
pfps 	DanC - press release is possible, but not too likely
ChrisW <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/chrisw,isnick> 	zakim, who is here?
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	On the phone I see GuusS, 
Sandro, Jeff_Heflin, [EDS], Peter_PS, Ian_Horrocks, DanC, 
Deb_Mcguinness, Marwan_Sabbouh, Sean, Mike_Dean, [IBM]
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	On IRC I see ChrisW, 
DeborahMc, pfps, IanH, seanb, sandro, RRSAgent, Zakim, DanC_jam, guus, 
logger
ChrisW <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/chrisw,isnick> 	zakim, [IBM] is 
temporarily ChrisW
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	+ChrisW; got it
ChrisW <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/chrisw,isnick> 	zakim, [EDS] is 
temporarily MikeS
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	+MikeS; got it
pfps 	DanC - what to do about extra CR conditions
-->| 	JosD (chatzilla@194.7.105.71 <mailto:chatzilla@194.7.105.71>) has 
joined #webont <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/%23webont>
pfps 	DanC - let Guus decide for the WG gets general consensus
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	+??P11
guus <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/guus,isnick> 	zakim, ??p11 is Jos
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	+Jos; got it
pfps 	DanC - press release - needs lots of work - can it be done
pfps 	Guus - press release is a good idea
pfps 	DanC - can ChrisW do some of the talking?
pfps 	ChrisW - Yes, with the usual IBM conditions
pfps 	DanC - press release chance is 45%
pfps 	IanH - Network Inference would be (more than) willing to talk to 
the press
pfps 	DebM - press release is a very good idea
pfps 	DanC - would you like to write one
pfps 	DebM - no
sandro <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/sandro,isnick> 	See 
http://www.w3.org/Press/ <http://www.w3.org/Press/> for models
pfps 	DanC - press release chance is 60% (due to better availability of 
Guus)
DanC_jam <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/danc_jam,isnick> 	(and encouragement 
from several)
pfps 	ACTION Guus - send message soliciting stuff for CR to the WG
pfps 	Sandro - target finish date - 15 September?
pfps 	DanC - sometime between 15 and 30 September
pfps 	4. STATUS CR DOCUMENTS
pfps 	4.1 General issues
pfps 	CR date is tenatively 18 August
pfps 	Guus - cross referencing between documents -
sandro <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/sandro,isnick> 	DanC: this is a nightmare. 
you MUST link to the date-specific versions of documents.
pfps 	DanC - would like to see versions that point to 18 August versions
pfps 	Mike S - also the references section should mention 18 August 
versions
pfps 	MikeS - see message from Mike Smith .../0009.html
DanC_jam <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/danc_jam,isnick> 	"The identifier of the 
particular publication is determined by the shortname, the status, and 
the date: http://www.w3.org/TR/YYYY/status-shortname-YYYYMMDD 
<http://www.w3.org/TR/YYYY/status-shortname-YYYYMMDD>." -- 
http://www.w3.org/2003/05/27-pubrules.html 
<http://www.w3.org/2003/05/27-pubrules.html>
pfps 	ACTION - DebM, MikeS, MikeD, Peter, Jos - fix all pointers and 
references to 18 August versions of documents
pfps 	pfps will try to include an example in the meeting minutes
pfps 	- cross reference to RDF documents
pfps 	Guus - can't point to editors drafts
pfps 	Pfps - S&AS really needs to point to editor's drafts
pfps 	Jos - test also has a problem
pfps 	DanC - cite last call working drafts - (could add separate pointer 
to drafts in reference sections)
pfps 	DanC - editorial note could fix this
pfps 	Jos - test has five or so links
pfps 	DanC - ideal is to have a caveat whereever there is a dependance 
on the post-last-call changes
pfps 	Mike - what about changes from last call
pfps 	Peter - get rid of typo changes, etc
pfps 	DanC - keep the others - they probably will stay even after 
recommendation
pfps 	4.2 Document-specific
pfps 	NB ACTION here was not accepted
pfps 	OWL Overview -
pfps 	Sandro - done - more or less - no pointer to requirements document
pfps 	Guus - Overview should be comprehensive, so include in list
pfps 	DebM - to put in list requires removing the "technical detail" quote
pfps 	DebM - will be done
pfps 	DebM - links to guide are to latest version
sandro <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/sandro,isnick> 	DanC: that's okay for 
these #fragment <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/%23fragment> links on each term.
DanC_jam <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/danc_jam,isnick> 	(in a non-normative 
document)
pfps 	DanC - that is OK, there MUST be a pointer to a dated version 
somewhere
pfps 	ACTION Deb - change Overview to add pointer to req
pfps 	Deb - done today
pfps 	Deb - done tomorrow - need to see minutes first
pfps 	OWL Guide
pfps 	Mike - DOCTYPE should be rdf:RDF
pfps 	Mike - where should the references to the ontologies (wine and 
food) point to
pfps 	DanC - can it be relative
pfps 	Mike - no - need a pointer in wine and food ontology
pfps 	DanC - point to .../TR/...
pfps 	Mike - done by tomorrow morning
pfps 	OWL Reference
pfps 	Guus - dam:item added
pfps 	Guus - dc date fixed
pfps 	Jos - owl.owl could use some extra stuff (e.g., cardinality a sub 
of mnCardinality)
pfps 	Guus - keep it as is
pfps 	DanC - let's not change anything
pfps 	Guus - name should be owl.rdf
pfps 	DanC - the pointers should be just owl, not owl.xxx
sandro <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/sandro,isnick> 	Dan: but that shouldn't be 
visible unless you're on that machine
pfps 	Guus - done tomorrow
DanC_jam <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/danc_jam,isnick> 	(or you peek/guess in 
HTTP space)
pfps 	OWL S&AS
pfps 	Peter - done tomorrow morning
pfps 	OWL Test
pfps 	Jos - Aug 6 version needed some changes - done
pfps 	Jos - references need to be fixed
pfps 	Jos - done today
pfps 	Guss - change to language tags done?
pfps 	Jos - not done?
pfps 	Sandro - something changed here, so all might be OK
pfps 	OWL Use Cases and Requirements
pfps 	Jeff - only pointers to be fixed
pfps 	Jeff - done tomorrow
DanC_jam <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/danc_jam,isnick> 	q+ to ask that anybody 
who can't make the deadline tomorrow to page me; send mail to 
connolly+pager@w3.org <mailto:connolly+pager@w3.org>
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	sees DanC_jam on the speaker 
queue
pfps 	DanC - please put CR versions at the editors' draft location
pfps 	Deb - what about ACKs?
pfps 	Guus - three new members - Charles White, [phillips], [see home page]
pfps 	DanC - not critical to fix, but try
pfps 	AOB
DanC_jam <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/danc_jam,isnick> 	ack danc
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	DanC_jam, you wanted to ask 
that anybody who can't make the deadline tomorrow to page me; send mail 
to connolly+pager@w3.org <mailto:connolly+pager@w3.org>
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	sees no one on the speaker 
queue
pfps 	DanC - please mail when editor is done (to WG)
sandro <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/sandro,isnick> 	DanC: I expect mail to the 
WG from each of the 6 people/drafts by close of business tomorrow. If 
you wont make it, page me.
sandro <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/sandro,isnick> 	(mail claiming victory, 
that you're done with the draft)
pfps 	DONE
pfps 	ADJOURN
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	-ChrisW
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	-MikeS
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	-Jos
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	-Jeff_Heflin
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	-Deb_Mcguinness
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	-Ian_Horrocks
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	-Sean
DanC_jam <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/danc_jam,isnick> 	(feel free to include 
things like md5sums, bytecounts, dates down to the second in your 
victory claim)
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	-Mike_Dean
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	-Marwan_Sabbouh
|<-- 	IanH has left irc.w3.org (Quit: [x]chat)
<--| 	seanb has left #webont <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/%23webont>
sandro <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/sandro,isnick> 	zakim, who is here?
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	On the phone I see GuusS, 
Sandro, Peter_PS, DanC
Zakim <irc://irc.w3.org:6665/zakim,isnick> 	On IRC I see JosD, ChrisW, 
DeborahMc, pfps, sandro, RRSAgent, Zakim, DanC_jam, guus, log
Received on Thursday, 7 August 2003 13:54:54 GMT

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