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MINUTES: W3C WAI User Agent Telecon 9 June 1999

From: Jon Gunderson <jongund@staff.uiuc.edu>
Date: Wed, 09 Jun 1999 13:18:41 -0500
Message-Id: <199906091818.NAA11188@staff2.cso.uiuc.edu>
To: w3c-wai-ua@w3.org
Chair: Jon Gunderson
Scribe: Ian Jacobs
Present: Harvey Bingham
Denis Anson
Marja Koivunen
Glen Gordon
Charles McCathieNevile
Rich Schwerdtfeger
Jim Allan

Completed Action Items

MN: Post references to mechanisms that can be used for applications to
exchange information for various operating systems: UNIX/X-Windows,
Microsoft windows, Apple Macintosh and Java

Continued Action Items

IJ: Write DJW about requirements T&S/WAI. Wrote thrice, no reply. Status:
Will follow up.
CMN: Write techniques for 7.2.2 and 7.2.6 CMN deferred until publication of
Note by Rich and Mark. Status: Will wait for new draft.
JG: Techniques for 7.2.2. Status: In progress.
IJ: Implement proposal to simplify the guidelines, separate techniques from
checkpoints, make checkpoints more global, move technichy checkpoints to
technique document.
IJ: Include specific navigation checkpoints for the following elements:
forms, form controls, tables, in next draft
IJ: Include checkpoint: Scripting events should be part of navigating to
active content checkpoint
IJ: Include checkpoint: Allow user to configure elements that are part of
active contents
IJ: Include checkpoint: Allow user to simulate event activator that an
element could respond to
IJ: Include checkpoint: Orient user to events an element can respond to
IJ: Include checkpoint: Allow user to navigate to elements that can respond
to events
IJ: Include checkpoint:: Add checkpoint: turn on/off access key at priority
2 level

New Action Items

IJ: Poste message to begin discussiion of fotification of scripting events.
Two main issues to be discussed: 1) What requirements on browser for
notification of changes to AT? 2) What required of AT to make these changes
JG:: Send URL of new charter to group.


Resoltuions can be found by searching for the text "resolutions"

1) ISSUE Saving form state: Saving filled in forms (Al)
JG: Does persistence of information benefit accessibility?
GG: Doesn't seem like an accessibility issues.
DA: Would help somewhat with energy conservation.
RS: Difficult to implement since time-limit on forms often.
GG: Also security issues. Don't save your banking PIN.
RESOLVED: The WG doesn't consider this an accessibility issue.
2) PROPOSED: Need to support "until user agent" clauses from WCAG.
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/1999AprJun/0150.html (See
also http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/1999JanMar/0286.html)
a) WCAG distinguish flicker (epilepsy problem) from blinking (screen reader
IJ: Even if flicker is covered by scripts, should be indicated explicitly.
DA: Risky to say "get rid of flicker" without killing all scripts and applets.
RESOLVED: Since caused by scripts/applets, support for turning
off/pausing/controlling covers this.
RESOLVED: Add to spec information specific to flicker and epilepsy.
b) RESOLVED: ADD checkpoint for "Use w3c specs" (Priority 2)
RESOLVED: No checkpoint for support of deprecated features
c) CMN: Why support lang? Contracting mechanisms in different languages
differ. Contractions come out wrong if not marked up.
DA: I think should be priority 1 since otherwise gibberish.
CMN: Not sure of this.
GG: Jaws supports multiple languages.
Proposed: 1) Desktops expose 2) ATs indicate change in language.
Rich: Not all AT developers have resources to support multiple languages.
If language supported, just deal with it, otherwise announce the change.
GG: I'm conflicted in importance. It's an item worth addressing. How often
does it come up? How difficult is it to adapt? Can turn of Grade II braille
if necessary. Grade II in American-English added to Jaws in recent months.
RESOLVED: a) ATs support language changes. Ensure that language information
be part of information exchanged with desktop browsers. CF. Rich's techniques.
3) PROPOSED: Combine 6.1.9 and 6.1.11. Provide info in techniques doc.
RESOLVED: Combine 6.1.9 and 6.1.11.
4) PROPOSED priority change to 5.2.9 -> 1.
(Allow the user specify that audio descriptions of video be rendered at the
same time as the video.)
5.2.8 [Priority 1] Allow the user to specify that captions or descriptions
for video be rendered at the same time as the video.
5.2.9 [Priority 2] Allow the user to specify that audio descriptions of
video be rendered at the same time as the video.
Resolution proposal: Merge 5.2.8 and 5.2.9 in 31 march draft
CMN: Case for merging them: for time-dependent equivalent content,
synchronize with the video presentation. Lots of cases are priority one.
But some cases fall away if you assume a single user. If you assume several
people at the same presentation, lots more requirements.
DA: Synchronization important for someone with a learning disability.
JA: With SMIL 2, synchronization of multiple description tracks will be
CMN: SMIL 1 doesn't really support audio descriptions.
a) Change priority of 5.2.9 to Priority 1. Change priority of 5.2.5 to Pri 1.
b) s/rendered at the same time as/synchronized with the presentation (The
one on audio as well).
c) Merge 5.2.8/5.2.9 (adjust wording)
5) PROPOSED rewrite of 6.3.2 and 6.3.3 (CMN)
6.3.2 [Priority 2] Alert the user when scripts or applets are executed.
6.3.3 [Priority 3] Provide information about document changes resulting
from the execution of a script.
Resolution proposal: Include checkpoint related to notification of document
a) Base Notification (the document changed)
b) Better Notification (where change occurred)
GG: In some cases, you have hidden fields where data is changing for form
designer. This could be sent across as document changes...
GG: Caret changes less important, since can be detected. We find dynamic
changes hard to track, notably if we move to the realm of caching data.
Useful to know when the cache should be reconstructed.
IJ: Inform of changes to rendered content.
IJ: Read/Write/Change notification
JG: Need to tell AT of changes, but ATs also need to tell users about changes.
RS: I have concerns about annoying announcements.
CMN: I don't think we want to go into implementation issues.
GG: If I know that the user has pressed the key, and then I get information
that the document changes, I could ignore the change since the user made
the change through the AT's functionality.
MK: Does this mean that there is not notification at all when it's
CMN: Notification also varies in its severity.
RS: Maybe we should require that the AT maintain the state of the document.
Allow the user to configure the AT to specify the level of information
RS: Analogy: If two people were working on a remote document and changes
reflected on both clients, you may or may not want to know about all changes.
DA: What about mouse position changes?
ACTION Ian: Move this to the list:
a) What requirements on browser for notification of changes to AT?
b) What required of AT to make these changes known to the user?
6) PROPOSED additional functionaility: Do you want to provide some audio
feedback as to audio length, either before it plays, or when paused, etc. ?
Resolution proposal: Next document there will be better information on
summary document. Do we need a checkpoint or more desciption in a technique
about summary information?
JA: Seems like an authoring thing: "This is a 15 Mbyte file."
IJ: But you could adjust playback rate and that wouldn't be valid.
Marja: Want relative information: how much viewed.
IJ: How does this information benefit accessibility?
GG: Marginally interesting, but so easy to abort in most cases. Or you can
read progress in the dialog box.
Marja: You may want to advance to the middle of a file.
GG: This is more navigational, though. True, if you can navigate, knowing
the dimensions helps.
IJ: Would be priority 3.
CONCLUSION: Re-examine after release of next guidelines.
7) New charter available! Will discuss next week. ACTION Jon: Send URL to
Jon Gunderson, Ph.D., ATP
Coordinator of Assistive Communication and Information Technology
Division of Rehabilitation - Education Services
University of Illinois at Urbana/Champaign
1207 S. Oak Street
Champaign, IL 61820

Voice: 217-244-5870
Fax: 217-333-0248
E-mail: jongund@uiuc.edu
WWW:	http://www.staff.uiuc.edu/~jongund
Received on Wednesday, 9 June 1999 14:18:26 UTC

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