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RE: When is a keyboard trap a keyboard trap

From: Vivienne CONWAY <v.conway@ecu.edu.au>
Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2012 18:31:11 +0800
To: Harry Loots <harry.loots@ieee.org>
CC: W3C WAI ig <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
Message-ID: <8AFA77741B11DB47B24131F1E38227A9CAB0E4CA06@XCHG-MS1.ads.ecu.edu.au>
Thanks for that Harry

I'll be interested in what the others say also.  I'm also wondering how you advise the user that a new window has been opened (or will be opened) and how they can tab (or if they can tab) to the control you provide.  Do you provide instructions on how to close the pop-up?


Regards

Vivienne L. Conway, B.IT(Hons), MACS CT, AALIA(cs)
PhD Candidate & Sessional Lecturer, Edith Cowan University, Perth, W.A.
Director, Web Key IT Pty Ltd.
v.conway@ecu.edu.au<mailto:v.conway@ecu.edu.au>
v.conway@webkeyit.com<mailto:v.conway@webkeyit.com>
Mob: 0415 383 673

This email is confidential and intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this email is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please notify me immediately by return email or telephone and destroy the original message.

________________________________
From: harry.loots@googlemail.com [harry.loots@googlemail.com] On Behalf Of Harry Loots [harry.loots@ieee.org]
Sent: Friday, 10 August 2012 6:11 PM
To: Vivienne CONWAY
Cc: W3C WAI ig
Subject: Re: When is a keyboard trap a keyboard trap

Hi Vivienne
I'll attempt to answer this...

I think that the origin of this guideline probably stems from the fact that in earlier versions of Flash (and other technologies), once it had received focus, it was not possible to tab out of it, and return to the parent HTML page.

In later versions of Flash one had to physically programme a keystroke event, which alowed the user to exit (tab out of) the Flash component and return focus to the parent HTML.

Thus: providing a way for a user to tab in and tab out of technologies such as Acrobat, if these are embedded in an HTML page, is essential. Failure to do so, creates a keyboard trap, and the only way out at times is to close the browser window and start again.


Insofar as pop-ups are concerned:

"Pop-up windows open in a variety of ways - new windows, new tabs.  Media players pop up from links and then the user has trouble closing them (if they even know they are in a new window).  Sometimes you can get out by Ctrl+W, or Alt+F4, and sometimes trying one of these causes lots of other problems.  It also depends upon what browser you're using.  For example in IE9, both Ctrl+W and Alt+F4 do the same thing, while in Firefox Alt+F4 displays a warningsaying do you want to close all tabs.  Also, sometimes closing the popup by a keyboard shortcut may close the browser which is a huge problem."


 *   Pop-up windows open in a variety of ways - new windows, new tabs.

    *   Ctrl-W closes the active tab  or window if there is only one tab present
    *   Alt-F4 will close the browser, including all tabs if there are tabs present, and may warn you if you have set your browser up to do so, that you are about to close all tabs (this is an explicit setting in Options->Tabs)

 *   The above is true for IE, as well as FF, etc. If there's only one tab present, then Alt-F4 = Ctrl-W will do the same thing.


 *   If the "pop-up" is a new browser that opens above the existing (parent) browser, then as long as the pop-up remains in focus Alt-F4/Ctrl-W will close the pop-up.
 *   Sometimes what appears to be a pop-up is actually a <DIV> which is displayed above the existing parent. In this case, Alt-F4/Ctrl-W will attempt to close the parent.


I would design all pop-ups with a close or cancel function, which closes the pop-up.

Shortcut keys will work as long as they belong to, and are actively programmed to close the intended pop-up. Thus, if a shortcut key is assigned to the parent, and a dialogue is displayed, and the user thinks that the shortcut key to close the window will shut the pop-up (dialogue), then they may be surprised when the browser is closed instead.

Assign shortcut keys specific to the task and make sure the commands are clear. E.g.: [Alt-n] Closes browser (this would be something like window.close), [Alt-x] closes dialogue (this could be something like getElementByID(ID).style.display=none)


I hope that helps

Kind regards

Harry


On 10 August 2012 07:59, Vivienne CONWAY <v.conway@ecu.edu.au<mailto:v.conway@ecu.edu.au>> wrote:
Hi all

Seeing you're all so good at answering questions, I'm wondering when something is truly a keyboard trap - the definitions seem to vary a lot.

2.1.2. states that if the keyboard focus can be moved to a component of the page, then you need to be able to move that focus away from that component solely by the keyboard as well.  and "If it requires more than unmodified arrow or tab keys or other standard exit methods, the user is advised of the method for moving focus away".

My question involves what "standard exit methods" this assumes.

Pop-up windows open in a variety of ways - new windows, new tabs.  Media players pop up from links and then the user has trouble closing them (if they even know they are in a new window).  Sometimes you can get out by Ctrl+W, or Alt+F4, and sometimes trying one of these causes lots of other problems.  It also depends upon what browser you're using.  For example in IE9, both Ctrl+W and Alt+F4 do the same thing, while in Firefox Alt+F4 displays a warningsaying do you want to close all tabs.  Also, sometimes closing the popup by a keyboard shortcut may close the browser which is a huge problem.

How do you decide what a "standard exit method" is?  There are quite a few lists, but many users aren't even aware of these shortcuts.  I'd personally like to see people provide an annoucement that the new window is opening and telling the user how to get back again, but I can't see that happening across the board.  For example, that's a lot of information to attach to a Twitter widget that's set to open a new window.

I appreciate your thoughts.


Regards

Vivienne L. Conway, B.IT<http://B.IT>(Hons), MACS CT, AALIA(cs)
PhD Candidate & Sessional Lecturer, Edith Cowan University, Perth, W.A.
Director, Web Key IT Pty Ltd.
v.conway@ecu.edu.au<mailto:v.conway@ecu.edu.au>
v.conway@webkeyit.com<mailto:v.conway@webkeyit.com>
Mob: 0415 383 673

This email is confidential and intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this email is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please notify me immediately by return email or telephone and destroy the original message.
________________________________________
From: pigsotwing@gmail.com<mailto:pigsotwing@gmail.com> [pigsotwing@gmail.com<mailto:pigsotwing@gmail.com>] On Behalf Of Andy Mabbett [andy@pigsonthewing.org.uk<mailto:andy@pigsonthewing.org.uk>]
Sent: Friday, 10 August 2012 1:07 AM
To: W3C WAI ig
Subject: Re: Limit on the links in a page

On 9 August 2012 15:06,  <accessys@smart.net<mailto:accessys@smart.net>> wrote:

> my mind boggles at why so many links.

Tables of data; indices, references/ citations, lists, whole-year
calendars, etc.

For example, there are around 170 in the 'Notes' section of today's
"featured article" on the English-language Wikipedia:

   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Ganga_Dynasty#Notes

 and far more than 200 in the whole article.

--
Andy Mabbett
@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk

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________________________________
This e-mail is confidential. If you are not the intended recipient you must not disclose or use the information contained within. If you have received it in error please return it to the sender via reply e-mail and delete any record of it from your system. The information contained within is not the opinion of Edith Cowan University in general and the University accepts no liability for the accuracy of the information provided.

CRICOS IPC 00279B
Received on Friday, 10 August 2012 10:32:56 UTC

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