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Minutes for XML Core WG telcon of 2004 September 1

From: Paul Grosso <pgrosso@arbortext.com>
Date: Wed, 1 Sep 2004 12:03:39 -0400
Message-ID: <F13E1BF26B19BA40AF3C0DE7D4DA0C033EEDA6@ati-mail01.arbortext.local>
To: "XML Core WG" <public-xml-core-wg@w3.org>


Lew  xx:08
François  off at xx:47

[11 organizations (11 with proxies) present out of 12]


Absent organizations

> 1. Accepting the minutes from the last telcon [3] and
>    the current task status [2] (have any questions, comments,
>    or corrections ready by the beginning of the call).


> 2. Miscellaneous administrivia.
> 3. Problem with xml:space in the Schema document for the XML namespace
> Masayasu Ishikawa <mimasa@w3.org> sent us email on this at:
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xml-core-wg/2004Jul/0019
> Norm thinks Mimasa is correct; we should not provide a default for
> xml:space.  Glenn agrees.  Richard agrees.
> But Henry questioned our decision.  Norm and Henry discussed it
> a bit; Richard and Glenn were absent.
> Henry found that Mimasa was not correct about not being able
> to make xml:space fixed.  Henry replied at:
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xml-core-wg/2004Aug/0013
> But it remains open whether we should change the default (or
> change the fact that it is defaulted).
> ACTION to Henry:  Check his schema collection to see if anyone 
> is using xml:space in an interesting way and see if this leads
> us to want to change the current declaration of xml:space.

Henry did some checking:

Although there are no uses of xml:space in his schema collection,
he is loath to change things unless we have a strong reason.

Richard, Glenn, John argue that having preserve as the default
in the XML namespace schema is wrong.

Richard would remove the default for xml:space completely from
the schema for the xml namespace.  Norm agrees.

Henry is nervous, but thinks the chance that anyone is using
this is small.

Richard says that XSLT has a different behavior for xml:space
equal to preserve--another argument for removing the xml:space
default from the schema.

CONSENSUS to remove the default for xml:space from the schema
for the xml namespace.

ACTION to Henry:  Make the actual change once we've figured
out how/when to announce this.

ACTION to JohnC:  Make an announcement to xml-dev that we plan
to make this change and request any feedback be sent to xml-editor.

ACTION to Henry:  Ditto to xml-schema-dev and to chairs.

> 4. XML errata.  The published 1.0 errata document is [8], the
>    published 1.1 errata document is [9], and the NEW PUBLIC
>    Potential Errata (PE) document is [7]. 
> 5. Namespaces in XML.
>   ACTION to Richard:  Produce a draft for NS1.0 2nd Ed.
> 6. Xinclude CR was published April 13 at:
>    http://www.w3.org/TR/2004/CR-xinclude-20040413
>    The updated test suite cover page is at
>    http://www.w3.org/XML/Test/XInclude/ 
> The PR-ready draft is at:
> http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/2004/07/PR-xinclude/
> The public DoC (aka latest issues list) is at:
> http://www.w3.org/XML/2004/07/ExIT-xinclude/issues.html
> [Note: The Director view displays incorrectly in IE6.0.]
> At 
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xml-core-wg/2004Jul/0025 
> Richard had sent a format for submitting test reports and an XSLT 
> to convert the report to an HTML page. 
> Richard put up results for ERH and himself:
> http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/2004/08/xinclude-implementation/re
> port.html
> We still need implementation feedback from Daniel.
> ACTION to DV:  Provide a table giving results (using 
> Richard's files) of
> running the test suite on your implementation.

ACTION continued.

> Paul sent an initial draft PR request at:
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xml-core-wg/2004Aug/0022
> IPR ptr should be http://www.w3.org/2002/08/xmlcore-IPR-statements

Henry also sent some comments:

> ACTION to Richard:  Add a test for xml:lang to the test suite.

Richard has just checked it such a test, but he cannot test it

> Paul asked ERH about his implementation wrt xml:lang and 
> accept/accept-language headers and received a brief reply
> (ERH is on hols) saying "Yes, I believe my XOM implementation 
> does handle both of those correctly."  More info after ERH returns.

Sounds like we might have an implementation of xml:lang and accept*.

> ACTION to DV:  Implement xml:lang.

ACTION continued.

> ACTION to Paul:  Update status section, pubrules, etc.

ACTION continued.

> 7. xml:id.
> Relaxing the constraint that there be one ID per element.
> ---------------------------------------------------------
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xml-id/2004Apr/0012
> We want to make sure that the xml:id spec is agnostic wrt whether 
> there is more than one thing of type id on one elemnt, as this is 
> a property of the validation mechanism.  
> Currently, the spec says nothing in this regard, so it is, in fact,
> agnostic.  Therefore, we have no action.
> So the reply to the comment is that the xml:id spec has no such
> constraint, so there is nothing to relax.

CONSENSUS to add a note to the spec on this.

ACTION to Norm:  Add the note and reply to the commenter.

> ACTION to Norm:  Raise a new issue about whether we need to fix 
> the references property as far as the behavior when no xml:id 
> declaration is available.

Henry had sent email on this.

ACTION to Norm:  Add to the issues list.

> Henry points out that there is no mention of [references] in xml:id,
> but there probably should be.
> Norm has collected the xml:id issues at:
> http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/2004/xmlcore/xmlid/issues.xml
> and put a new version of the draft at
> http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/2004/xmlcore/xmlid/xml-id.html
> ID Strictness 
> -------------
> Commentor figures that non-validating parsers shouldn't have 
> to check for xml:id validity.
> Currently, conformance to xml:id does require non-validating 
> parsers to check for xml:id validity; of course, no parser is 
> required to conform to xml:id.
> We discussed this for some time.  
> Richard send email outlining our options at:
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xml-core-wg/2004Aug/0024

He outlines options of strict, moderate, lax id checking.

We discussed this topic again at length.

Richard would like to know that ids, for example, don't 
contain spaces.

Then we started asking if id values should be NCName or Name.

Tentative CONSENSUS that we would do "moderate" where id values 
should be NCName (with some uncertainty).

We left open what kind of error it would be if the above isn't 
the case.

ACTION to Norm:  Send email with his latest proposal.

> [1] http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/Core
> [2] http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/Core#tasks
> [3] 
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xml-core-wg/2004Aug/0023
> [7]
> http://www.w3.org/XML/2004/02/proposed-xml10-3e-and-xml11-errata.html
> [8] http://www.w3.org/XML/xml-V10-3e-errata
> [9] http://www.w3.org/XML/xml-V11-1e-errata
> [12] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/chairs/2004AprJun/0058.html 
Received on Wednesday, 1 September 2004 16:04:25 UTC

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