W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-html@w3.org > September 2009

Re: what is dt?

From: Tab Atkins Jr. <jackalmage@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 10:21:45 -0500
Message-ID: <dd0fbad0909170821p5945e1e6qa50e7604fe4c32ea@mail.gmail.com>
To: James Graham <jgraham@opera.com>
Cc: Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com>, Shelley Powers <shelleyp@burningbird.net>, Smylers@stripey.com, public-html@w3.org
On Thu, Sep 17, 2009 at 10:15 AM, James Graham <jgraham@opera.com> wrote:
> Tab Atkins Jr. wrote:
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 10:49 PM, Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> h1:
>>> - Extremely likely to be styled by the site in a way that's not
>>> appropriate
>>> for a figure/details heading.
>>> - Would interfere with attempts to infer an outline for the page.
>>
>> While default styling is a bit of an issue, I'm not sure how using
>> <h1> would interfere with the outline algorithm.  <figure> is
>> explicitly a sectioning root, and <details> could presumably be made
>> one as well.
>>
>> As well, default styling isn't a huge issue.  I think it's pretty
>> common to restyle your <hx>s anyway, and a simple "details > h1" rule
>> would catch most of it (obviously "details > h1:first-of-type" would
>> be best, but that's more complex, and more detail than will commonly
>> be needed I believe).  Similarly "figure > h1" would allow easy
>> restyling.
>
> I believe reusing <h1> would interact poorly with legacy software that
> assumes headings should be used for navigation. In particular I would expect
> existing AT to have a problem with this.

Isn't this a similar issue with <blockquote>?  Does legacy software
explicitly ignore headings in <blockquote> when navigating?

Are similar problems caused by using just <h1> for headings and using
sectioning elements to set their level implicitly?  I really have no
idea how ATs work here; I'm wondering, though, if we're already
breaking navigation enough that doing this won't be a problem.

> On the subject of the outline algorithm, it is unclear to me that <figure>
> should be a sectioning root. I would expect that figure > dd would be a
> sectioning root but one could use <h1> in figure > dt to include a figure in
> the outline view of a document.

Possibly.  Even with that, though, wouldn't headings in figure > dt
cause navigation problems of the same nature?  If software doesn't
know that something is supposed to be a sectioning root, it will
incorrectly pull those headings into the global outline.

~TJ
Received on Thursday, 17 September 2009 15:22:44 UTC

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