- From: Peter F. Patel-Schneider <pfps@research.bell-labs.com>
- Date: Sat, 18 May 2002 06:29:23 -0400
- To: jos.deroo.jd@belgium.agfa.com
- Cc: www-webont-wg@w3.org
From: "Jos De_Roo" <jos.deroo.jd@belgium.agfa.com>
Subject: Re: ISSUE: DAML+OIL semantics is too weak
Date: Fri, 17 May 2002 21:56:42 +0200
> [...]
>
> > > 1) there is one thing I would like to reiterate
> > > suppose we have a paradoxical pair such as e.g.
> > >
> > > I1 = { ?x a :R } log:implies { ?x a [ owl:complementOf ?x ] } .
> > > I2 = { ?x a [ owl:complementOf ?x ] } log:implies { ?x a :R } .
> >
> > This says that a resource belongs to :R iff it does not belong to itself.
> >
> > So, does :R belong to :R, and what can be gained from this?
> > Well, if :R belongs to :R then :R does not belong to :R, which cannot be,
> > so no model of the above has :R belonging to :R.
> > However, if :R does not belong to itself then :R belongs to :R, which
> > cannot be, so no model of the above has :R not belonging to :R.
> > Therefore the two implications above have no models.
> >
> > > then deriving a contradiction from that is indeed a
> > > VALID inference but it is not a SOUND inference and
> >
> > The above reasoning is SOUND.
> > SOUND reasoning means that the derived formulae semantically follow from
> > the assumptions, i.e., that if you can derive X from A1, ..., An,
> > then A1, ..., An entails X. But I1, I2 has no models, so I1, I2 entails X
> > for any X, so deriving any X from I1, I2 is indeed SOUND reasoning.
>
> All we wanted to say is that
> { :R a [ owl:complementOf :R ] } log:implies { :R a :R } .
> or simplified
> :R a :R .
>
> could be argued, but ***according to that rule*** the
> premise is FALSE and we (in our oldfashioned mode)
> call that an UNSOUND argument (although it is VALID)
> and we avoid such derivations.
I have no idea what the distinction you are getting at here is. There are
several possibilities that I see.
1/ A valid implication, like a -> a v b, but the premise is not true, so
the conclusion might not be. An argument that purports to derive a v b
is incorrect, and any proof system that would sanction it is unsound.
2/ A not-valid implication, like a -> a ^ b, but the premise is true. An
argument that purports to derive b is again incorrect, and any proof
system that would sanction it is unsound.
Neither seems to fit. Could you please clarify your meaning for me?
> I agree that we have to agree on terminology, so how
> would you call an argument which is based on assumptions
> which are false?
Incorrect, or maybe unsound, but I don't see any difference between this
kind of argument and an argument that uses an incorrect inference.
Maybe you are making a distinction between an argument that uses an invalid
implication and an argument that uses a non-true premise. However, there
is little difference between the two, as the non-true premise could be the
invalid implication.
> (and which is something we should avoid I think,
> otherwise "if I see 2 suns, my aunt is a car"
> and also in case of true premises we can simplify a
> proof argument to its conclusion or T -> C as C)
> > > 2) yes, more desirable consequences should follow
> > > from more implications, but also there should
> > > be more rules for deriving inconsistencies
> > > such as e.g.
> > >
> > > { :rule16r1 .
> > > ?s ?p ?o .
> > > ?s a [ a owl:Restriction;
> > > owl:onProperty ?p;
> > > owl:minCardinality ?min;
> > > owl:maxCardinality ?max;
> > > owl:toClass ?C ] .
> > > { ?s ?p ?o . ?o a ?C } math:entailCount ?n .
> > > ?n math:lessThan ?min
> > > }
> > > log:implies
> > > { ?s :inconsistentWith owl:Restriction } .
> > >
> > > where math:entailCount is just something to count
> > > how many times we can entail its subject graph
> > > from what was given
> >
> > The above DAML+OIL restriction says that the set of resources that have
> > atleast ?min fillers for ?p that belong to ?C is the same as the set of
> > resources that have atmost ?max fillers for ?p that belong to ?C. From
> > this weird restriction lots of unusual consequences result. I think that
> > it would be much better if you revised your example to eliminate the
> > weirdness. I can't determine what is supposed to be happening here
> otherwise.
>
> Oops, that second line
> ?s ?p ?o
> is there too much, as are other things, so something like
>
> { :rule16r1 .
> ?s a [ a owl:Restriction; owl:onProperty ?p; owl:minCardinality ?min ] .
> { ?s ?p ?o } math:proofCount ?n .
> ?n math:lessThan ?min }
> log:implies
> { ?s :inconsistentWith owl:Restriction } .
>
> (but I have to check with running code and reread DAML+OIL ASAP)
>
> > Also, I have no idea what
> >
> > > how many times we can entail its subject graph
> >
> > means.
> >
> > Entailment just is, it is not a process that can be performed a number of
> > times.
>
> Well again "proof argument" wise, this is in the sense of
> "how many proof trees can we find for { ?s ?p ?o }"
> and that number should be less than ?min
> Naming things such as math:proofCount
> seems to be the more difficult job ;-)
Well, if { ?s ?p ?o } follows from some assumptions, most proof systems
will have an infinite number of proof trees for it, so I still don't
understand what you are getting at here.
(It may be that you are trying to say that if ?s has too few known ?p-fillers,
then there is a contradiction, but this does not follow, nor do many of its
variants follow.)
> --
> Jos
peter
Received on Saturday, 18 May 2002 06:29:37 UTC