- From: Ian Yang <ian.html@gmail.com>
- Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2016 10:49:48 +0800
- To: "Tab Atkins Jr." <jackalmage@gmail.com>
- Cc: CSS public list <www-style@w3.org>
- Message-ID: <CAFhBhuN=aZzNsi5fTCfW-78Xkx+2TbmU8mDML9=8ndvELDgWzw@mail.gmail.com>
2016-10-07 4:21 GMT+08:00 Tab Atkins Jr. <jackalmage@gmail.com>: > On Thu, Oct 6, 2016 at 1:45 AM, Ian Yang <ian.html@gmail.com> wrote: > > Any advice, please? Personally, I hope this pseudo element could be > adopted > > as early as possible. It's not like developers can use it right away > once it > > is adopted because it takes time for major browsers to implement it. > > > > This pseudo element can do a lot more than just wrapping <dt> and <dd> > > pairs. For years, we have been adding extra <div>s or <span>s into our > HTML > > codes just because we have to achieve a certain layout or positioning. > With > > ::wrap pseudo element, we can say good bye to that inflexible approach > and > > styling or redesigning web pages would become impressively flexible and > > time-saving. I really don't see any reason not to welcome it and see it > > joins the CSS family. > > As fantasai and I stated earlier in the thread: > > > Yeah, this is the big thing. New pseudos that wrap "real" elements in > > some way are... not popular among implementors. The idea for ::wrap > > goes back well over a decade, and the complexity it adds to the > > platform versus the benefit you get, when compared to just adding > > wrapper elements in your HTML, has meant that implementors have never > > bitten at the idea. > > To be clear, we only add features to the spec that have use cases and > interest in being implemented in at least two major browser engines. > (Those are the most important steps of the process as described by > WHATWG <https://wiki.whatwg.org/wiki/FAQ#Is_there_a_process_for_ > adding_new_features_to_a_specification.3F>, > which we generally follow as well.) So there is nothing really simple > about this; adding features to the web platform is generally a > multi-year effort that involves convincing a lot of people that what > you want is (a) important; (b) cannot be accomplished any other way; > (c) will be used by lots of people (on the same order as existing > features of the web); (d) is something browser engine engineers want > to spend their resources on. > > It's definitely not impossible! But neither is it just a matter of > having a good idea and then sitting back. This idea, in particular, > has been suggested for over a decade, and implementors have never been > interested in it (as it ends up adding significant complexity, both to > the CSS language itself, and to implementations), so you're facing an > extreme uphill battle here. > > ~TJ > Speaking of importance and use cases, I can assure you that there is no dedicated web developers in the world who value the maintainability and semantics of HTML while doubt the importance and use cases of ::wrap pseudo element. Take this lists.w3.org page <https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2016Sep/> for example, the metadata area under the heading should have been markuped with <dl>. But because there has been no way to wrap <dt> and <dd> pairs with CSS, the developer had to use the less semantic <ul> and <dfn>. Yet another example is that, "left and right columns" layout design is everywhere so we have been having to add two wrapper <div>s into HTML for that kind of purpose. The aforementioned examples are just a tip of iceberg. The use cases of ::wrap are apparently more than the use cases of :first-child and so on. Since getting more people involved seems to be a necessary step in proposing a feature like this one, I will go through the step. Is there a CSS equivalent of whatwg/html on GitHub <https://github.com/whatwg/html/issues> in which I can open a new issue?
Received on Friday, 7 October 2016 02:50:17 UTC