W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > www-style@w3.org > June 2016

Re: FlexBox keyboard disconnect - new property proposal

From: Florian Rivoal <florian@rivoal.net>
Date: Sun, 19 Jun 2016 00:01:20 +0900
Cc: Brian Kardell <bkardell@gmail.com>, Léonie Watson <tink@tink.uk>, "www-style@w3.org" <www-style@w3.org>
Message-Id: <59F0FCB9-53AC-412D-837B-2835C07F6749@rivoal.net>
To: "Tab Atkins Jr." <jackalmage@gmail.com>

> On Jun 18, 2016, at 06:06, Tab Atkins Jr. <jackalmage@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> On Fri, Jun 17, 2016 at 7:52 AM, Brian Kardell <bkardell@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Fri, Jun 17, 2016 at 5:53 AM, Léonie Watson <tink@tink.uk> wrote:
>>> On the face of it this seems
>>> like a good solution, but Simon made a good point - what happens when the
>>> keyboard disconnect is actually useful?
>> 
>> Can you provide an example where the keyboard disconnect is actually useful?
>> I'm not saying such a case doesn't exist, simply that it is non-obvious and
>> if that is a use-case it would be helpful to have an example documented.
> 
> Long-standing accessibility advice is to put your "main content" first
> in the DOM and things like sidebars and advertising later, using CSS
> to arrange them as desired.  This is the origin of the "holy grail
> layout" (float-based) and similar CSS hackery - Flexbox handles these
> cases much easier (example in
> <https://drafts.csswg.org/css-flexbox/#order-accessibility>).  Or
> check out the Grid example
> <https://drafts.csswg.org/css-grid/#source-independence> - the
> portrait and landscape layouts are slightly different in visual order,
> but each layout makes a lot of sense individually.
> 
> As Henrik said (and fantasai and I and others have repeatedly said in
> the past), this has nothing to do with flexbox itself - CSS offers a
> wealth of ways to lay out a page such that the visual and DOM orders
> don't match.

I would also add that not only can the visual order and the DOM order
get out of sync, since the visual rendering is a 2D thing rather than
a linear one, There isn't necessarily an order. Some 2D documents are
still essentially linear (e.g. top menu, then content, then footer),
but many are not (e.g. same thing with side bars, or anything a tad
complex).

 - Florian
Received on Saturday, 18 June 2016 15:01:47 UTC

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