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Re: [css-round-display] Suggest ¡®polar-anchor¡¯ property for positioning elements without overflowing

From: Brad Kemper <brad.kemper@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2015 11:53:58 -0800
Cc: www-style@w3.org, fantasai <fantasai.lists@inkedblade.net>
Message-Id: <C6B8A4C7-F8AC-4353-9016-27A68423C9A0@gmail.com>
To: Jihye Hong <jh.hong@lge.com>
In the call today, there was this:

Florian: If we did that, I think polar-distance should have the auto.
BradK: It's either polar-distance or polar-origin. One being non-auto would be the trigger.

That's what I said, but I meant to say "either polar-distance or polar-angle". See below, for the the beginning of the proposal that uses 'polar-distance: auto' to mean no centering and no polar positioning, and 'polar-distance: 0' to mean centered (in the absence of anything that would move it vertically or horizontally from there). 

There are more emails after this one that detail this a little more, and go into how a 'center' property would be good and help with this too. I brought it up because I didn't want multiple was to do abspos centering, and a center property (with a center-x and center-y shorthand) would be my preferred way. 



> On Oct 9, 2015, at 10:44 AM, Brad Kemper <brad.kemper@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Brad Kemper
> On Oct 8, 2015, at 3:10 AM, Jihye Hong <jh.hong@lge.com> wrote:
> 
>>> On 23/09/2015 05:40 PM, Jihye Hong wrote:
>>> Hello all,
>>> I¡¯m Jihye Hong from LG Electronics. I attended the last F2F meeting at Paris and presented CSS 
>>> Round Display demos. I hope you could remember me. : )
>>> 
>>> In the middle of discussing about css-round-display [1] at the F2F Paris meeting, there was an
>>> issue about positioning items to the edge of the containing block without overflowing [2]. When 
>>> authors would align elements in the circular display using ¡®polar-angle¡¯ and ¡®polar-distance¡¯, 
>>> they should find out the accurate value of ¡®polar-distance¡¯ for avoiding elements to get out of 
>>> the edge of the containing block. We described the issue in the spec and deliberate how to 
>>> resolve it.
>>> We potentially came up with a ¡®polar-anchor¡¯ property to set a anchor point of the element as a 
>>> suggested solution in the meeting. The anchor point specifies a position which is a 
>>> representative point of the element aligned with a containing block. Setting the anchor point 
>>> makes easier to position the elements inside the containing block. To design the ¡®polar-anchor¡¯, 
>>> I refer to the ¡®background-position¡¯ property [3].
>>> You can see the Polyfill with ¡®polar-anchor¡¯ [4][5].
>>> 
>>> The ¡®polar-anchor¡¯ has the value <position> | auto. The value indicates which horizontal and 
>>> vertical offset of the element is aligned to the containing block¡¯s alignment position.
>>> The <position> value is defined like below: 
>>> <position> = [
>>> [ left | center | right | top | bottom | <percentage> | <length> ]
>>> |
>>> [ left | center | right | <percentage> | <length> ]
>>> [ top | center | bottom | <percentage> | <length> ]
>>> |
>>> [ center | [ left | right ] [ <percentage> | <length> ]? ] &&
>>> [ center | [ top | bottom ] [ <percentage> | <length> ]? ]
>>> ]
>>> 
>>> I have several questions about the ¡®polar-anchor¡¯ property:
>>> - Is the ¡®polar-anchor¡¯ property useful to be a new property in css-round-display?
>>> - Is naming of the property reasonable?
>>> - Is value types of the property suitable? Any other types to be considered?
>>> 
>>> Happy to have your feedback!
>>> 
>>> Regards,
>>> Jihye Hong
>>> 
>>> [1] http://www.w3.org/TR/css-round-display-1/ 
>>> [2] https://www.w3.org/Style/CSS/Tracker/actions/714
>>> [3] http://www.w3.org/TR/2014/WD-css3-background-20140204/#background-position
>>> [4] http://anawhj.github.io/jRound/demo/polar/anchor.html 
>>> [5] http://anawhj.github.io/jRound/src/css-polar.js 
>>> ©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥©¥
>>> Jihye Hong
>>> Research Engineer
>>> SoftWare Platform R&D Lab,
>>> CTO Division, LG Electronics Inc.
>>> Mobile : 82-10-7276-5695
>>> E-mail : jh.hong@lge.com
>> 
>> I took some feedback from CC last week [1] and added 'polar-anchor' property to the CSS Round Display ED [2].
>> I'd like to discuss about this spec whether its definition is reasonable.
>> 
>> When the 'polar-anchor' property was suggested, there was a consideration of 'auto' value for the property. 
>> But I'm not sure that 'auto' value is necessary for 'polar-anchor'. fantasai had mentioned auto keyword for 'polar-anchor' during the F2F meeting at Paris[3]. Could you tell me your thought about the way 'auto' works for 'polar-anchor'?
>> 
>> I thought 2 approaches to specify 'auto'.
>> When we have elements with 'polar-distance' and 'polar-angle' values, the anchor points are specified by one of methods as below : 
>> 
>>    method 1) 
>>        - If polar-angle value of an element is 0deg, 90deg, 180deg, and 270deg,
>>            - polar-anchor value is '50% 0%', '100% 50%', '50% 100%', and '0% 50%'.
>>            - if the polar-distance value is 100%, 
>>                polar-anchor value is adjusted to avoid overflowing.
>>        - If polar-angle value of an element isn't 0deg, 90deg, 180deg, and 270deg,
>>            - and if 0deg < polar-angle < 90deg, 
>>                polar-anchor value is '100% 0%'
>>            - or if 90deg < polar-angle < 180deg, 
>>                polar-anchor value is '100% 100%'
>>            - or if 180deg < polar-angle < 270deg, 
>>                polar-anchor value is '0% 100%'
>>            - or if 270deg < polar-angle < 360deg, 
>>                polar-anchor value is '0% 0%'
>>        - The result is look like [4]. 
>>        - This guarantees not overflow.
>> 
>>    method 2) 
>>        - An anchor point is on the edge of a circumscribed circle of an element.
>>        - An anchor point is also on a straight line made from the center point of a containing block and the center point of a element's content box.
>>        - The result will be [5].
>>        - This guarantees not overflow.
>> 
>> But both methods have side-effects. In method 1, distances between neighboring elements are not even.
>> And in method 2, there is a gap between the edge of a containing block and the edge of an element's content box when the polar-distance value is 100%.
>> 
>> As you can see, it's tricky to specify the expecting effect from auto value.
>> Which definition of auto is more appropriate?
>> Do you have any thought?
>> 
>> Thanks : )
>> - Jihye Hong
>> 
>> [1] https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2015Oct/0012.html 
>> [2] https://drafts.csswg.org/css-round-display/#propdef-polar-anchor 
>> [3] http://log.csswg.org/irc.w3.org/css/2015-08-26/#e583134
>> [4] https://github.com/anawhj/jRound/blob/master/demo/polar/polar_anchor_auto_method1.JPG
>> [5] https://github.com/anawhj/jRound/blob/master/demo/polar/polar_anchor_auto_method2.JPG 
> 
> I've been thinking about this for a while. If what you want is something to nudge a polar positioned item vertically or horizontally, then my earlier proposal would give you that. What I suggested was: don't make 'polar' a separate value of 'position'. Instead, let 'polar-angle' and 'polar-distance' combine with positions absolute, fixed, and relative, in the same way that left, right, top, and bottom do. The effects of left, right, top, bottom, polar-angle, and polar-distance would be cumulative, so if you wanted a horizontal or vertical offset, you would usually use 'top' and 'left' for that. 
> 
> As a bonus, this would also enable you to use angle and distance for relative positioning, which might be useful (some might find it more convenient than setting horizontal and vertical offsets). 
> 
> The way this could be made to work is that the initial value of 'polar-distance' would be 'auto', meaning it would have no effect on positioning. Non-auto values for absolute or fixed position items would be measured from the center of the contains block. 
> 
> I think most of the time, having a 2-dimensional polar-anchor seems like overkill. Isn't the real issue that you often (usually?) want 'polar-distance: 100%' to just touch the inside edge of the containing block? I would do this (an effect similar to 'polar-anchor: auto) by adding an optional keyword to 'polar-distance' value of either 'outer' or 'center' which determined the anchor point used for 'polar-distance: 100%'. 
> 
> 'Polar-distance: 100% outer' would mean that an imaginary ellipse that touched all four sides of the border box (equivalent to border-radius:100%) would be be positioned as far out along the ray as it could without passing the inner edge of the containing block's border shape. 
> 
> Polar-distance: 0% would still mean completely centered, and all other percentages would be between those two points. 
> 
> This would mean the center of the positioned object would always be the same distance from the inner edge of the round display, without having to give each element a separate value, and would also hug the inner edges of a rectangular display. A little extra padding on the positioned element would further help prevent overlap with the edge (as would 'polar-distance: 95%' instead of 100%, as would nudging individual items with 'top' and 'left' properties). If even more control is needed, we could have a 'polar-margin' property that guaranteed a distance between the imaginary ellipse and the inner border edge of the container. 
> 
> 
> Brad Kemper
>> 

Received on Wednesday, 11 November 2015 19:54:28 UTC

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