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Re: [css3-exclusions][css3-gcpm] Plan B exclusions

From: Brad Kemper <brad.kemper@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 18 Jan 2012 09:18:50 -0800
Cc: Alan Stearns <stearns@adobe.com>, www-style@w3.org
Message-Id: <0FE4CCBB-2FA2-45C9-9550-A6285331D614@gmail.com>
To: Håkon Wium Lie <howcome@opera.com>

On Jan 12, 2012, at 12:49 PM, Håkon Wium Lie wrote:

>> A. Padding and margins are usually needed to ensure that inline content does
>> not touch or slightly overlap the shape. Given how the car image in 13.4 is
>> likely masked, I'd expect the text to end up un-readably close to the edge
>> of the car unless you allow for some margins on the shape. 
> When the alpha-channel is used to determine the exclusion zone, it can
> express -- with greater detail than any property -- where the content
> is allowed and not allowed. In these cases, no new properties are needed.

Sometimes an author might want text to flow into the negative/counter spaces of the image, sometimes not, and it would seem a property could be helpful with that. Sometimes a counter space is not completely closed off, but the author still wouldn't want text to flow into it, like water into the top of a bottle. I don't know how that could be handled, although maybe combining an exclusion margin with a 'do/don't fill counter spaces' property would work.

>> Similarly, the
>> drop cap example in 13.5 does not demonstrate how the gap between the large
>> 'y' and the smaller text is achieved. I think we need exclusion margins (and
>> padding for inclusions).
> I agree that spacing behavor must be described somehow, and in this
> case we don't have an alpha channel to use. This is noted in issue 13:
> "Some kind of spacing behavior must be defined." We could,
> perceivably, use some kinde of kerning parameter from the font in
> question. But this may be unavailable or hard to extract. So a
> property may be easier. We would only need one property, no? 

Maybe just 'margin' on the exclusion would be enough, to where it was no longer a shorthand when applied to an exclusion, and only applied to stuff that wraps it, and only collapsed with similarly scoped exclusions? If that is too magic, then maybe call it 'exclude-margin'.

What about the padding or column gap of the parent of the exclusion? Maybe it should also follow any intruding excluding shapes.

In example 70:
   • what is determining the stand-off so that the text doesn't touch the "y"? 

   • Would there be a way to have text also go to the left of the descender of the "y", or for the other to choose the desired behavior there? 

   • Are you imaginging there would also be something to get the text to line up with the top of the lowercase letters?
Received on Wednesday, 18 January 2012 17:19:35 UTC

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