- From: r12a <ishida@w3.org>
- Date: Thu, 16 Jun 2022 17:23:52 +0100
- To: www-international@w3.org
- Message-ID: <f4f570d7-6ef5-6271-b339-b5ab9108f8df@w3.org>
https://www.w3.org/2022/06/16-i18n-minutes.html
text version:
– DRAFT –
Internationalization Working Group Teleconference
16 June 2022
[2]Agenda. [3]IRC log.
[2] https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/4e5482e3-94c9-4875-abb7-1bf44c66bdf9/20220616T150000
[3] https://www.w3.org/2022/06/16-i18n-irc
Attendees
Present
Addison, Atsushi, Felix, Fuqiao, JcK, Richard
Regrets
Bert
Chair
Addison Phillips
Scribe
addison, xfq_
Contents
1. [4]Agenda Review
2. [5]Action Items
3. [6]Info Share
4. [7]RADAR Review
5. [8]RTL scripts update
6. [9]WICG/manifest-incubations review
7. [10]WebGPU
8. [11]agenda+ Add commentary to 9.3 Working with personal
names
9. [12]AOB?
10. [13]Summary of action items
Meeting minutes
<addison> trackbot, prepare teleconference
Agenda Review
Action Items
<addison> [14]https://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/
open
[14] https://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/open
close ACTION-1157
<trackbot> Closed ACTION-1157.
atsushi: jlreq-d repo created
close ACTION-1158
<trackbot> Closed ACTION-1158.
close ACTION-1161
<trackbot> Closed ACTION-1161.
Info Share
<addison> xfq: trying to use netlify to preview changes to
repos
<addison> ... only did i18n-drafts and specdev
<addison> ... previously we used pr-preview, but it cannot
handle the changes to images or styles or scripts or webfonts
<addison> ... netlify can handle this
<addison> ... doesn't support diff
<addison> ... for specs plan is to use both; pr-preview for
diff and netlify for preview
<addison> ... and netlify needed for web pages
addison: the preview is better than before
RADAR Review
[15]https://github.com/w3c/i18n-request/projects/1
[15] https://github.com/w3c/i18n-request/projects/1
addison: DCAT 3?
atsushi: still reviewing
RTL scripts update
[16]https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-core/
2022AprJun/0119.html
[16] https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-core/2022AprJun/0119.html
[17]https://github.com/w3c/i18n-drafts/pull/399
[17] https://github.com/w3c/i18n-drafts/pull/399
[18]https://deploy-preview-399--i18n-drafts.netlify.app/
questions/qa-scripts.en
[18] https://deploy-preview-399--i18n-drafts.netlify.app/questions/qa-scripts.en
r12a: this is quite a big change
<r12a> [19]https://www.w3.org/International/questions/
qa-scripts.en.html
[19] https://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-scripts.en.html
r12a: if you look at the original ^
… if you look at the old article, you'll see the question used
to be "What directions are commonly localized languages written
in?"
… if you look at the Netlify version, it's "What languages are
written with right-to-left scripts?"
… immediately after the answer there's a ToC
… I removed the ToC
… languages are never RTL, scripts are RTL
… you have this very looong table
… total number of speakers from SIL Ethnologue
… grand total of 2,305,048,719 potential users of RTL scripts
… and these are just modern languages
… and there's a paragraph at the bottom about historical usage
of scripts
… I might have to rearrange the table
… in alphabetical order before publishing
… this was in response to Craig Cornelius saying the new
scripts are not mentioned in this article
addison: any objections to publishing this?
[silence]
ACTION: richard: publish updated rtl languages article
<trackbot> Created ACTION-1162 - Publish updated rtl languages
article [on Richard Ishida - due 2022-06-23].
WICG/manifest-incubations review
[20]https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/
issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen+label%3As%3Awicg-manifest-incubat
ions
[20] https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues?q=is:issue+is:open+label:s:wicg-manifest-incubations
[21]https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/1554
[21] https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/1554
addison: as an introduction, this group has a proposal
… to add some stuff in the web app manifest
… adding translations to the manifest format
… the first tissue is they don't define how the matching is
done
[22]https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/1555
[22] https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/1555
xfq: I guess because it's still a draft proposal
addison: any objections?
[silence]
addison: the next issue
… they match the translations according to the order of the
items
… if the document gets serialised the order might be wrong
xfq: why would serialisation change the order?
addison: think of your favourite JSON serialization library
… does it change the order during serialisation?
xfq: I guess that depends on the implementation
addison: yeah
atsushi: I worked with some localisation tools like Pontoon
… @@
<atsushi> [23]pontoon
[23] https://pontoon.mozilla.org/
<atsushi> +1 to go
<r12a> +1
[24]https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/1556
[24] https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/1556
addison: last one
… they don't associate dir with each translation
<atsushi> +1
addison: they only have a file level dir
<r12a> [25]https://github.com/gpuweb/gpuweb/issues/
2780#issuecomment-1157495027
[25] https://github.com/gpuweb/gpuweb/issues/2780#issuecomment-1157495027
WebGPU
[26]https://github.com/gpuweb/gpuweb/issues/
2780#issuecomment-1157495027
[26] https://github.com/gpuweb/gpuweb/issues/2780#issuecomment-1157495027
[27]https://github.com/gpuweb/gpuweb/issues/
2780#issuecomment-1141227619
[27] https://github.com/gpuweb/gpuweb/issues/2780#issuecomment-1141227619
[xfq introduces the issue]
r12a: [28]https://github.com/gpuweb/gpuweb/issues/
2780#issuecomment-1141227619 mentions "switch the language of
error messages and other strings after device creation", but
it's not related to this issue, which is about the lang & dir
of the string itself
… even if it's not changed
[28] https://github.com/gpuweb/gpuweb/issues/2780#issuecomment-1141227619
addison: each message item should have their own lang & dir
… it's ok to have a default
r12a: what we want is to let them do both
… they only need to specify the strings that are problematic
… other strings should use the default
r12a: you need to have the declaration at the top of the file
and have the possibility of using and override on every string
… not related to change the language
JcK: when do we need to tag these strings?
r12a: like numbers
JcK: the other great example is interntaional domain names
agenda+ Add commentary to 9.3 Working with personal names
<r12a> [29]https://github.com/w3c/bp-i18n-specdev/pull/
72#discussion_r899116063
[29] https://github.com/w3c/bp-i18n-specdev/pull/72#discussion_r899116063
<r12a> [30]https://
deploy-preview-72--bp-i18n-specdev.netlify.app/
[30] https://deploy-preview-72--bp-i18n-specdev.netlify.app/
<r12a> [31]https://
deploy-preview-72--bp-i18n-specdev.netlify.app/#loc_names
[31] https://deploy-preview-72--bp-i18n-specdev.netlify.app/#loc_names
r12a: I took the text from the article
… there's a thread in github
… addison I think I'm mostly OK
[32]https://
deploy-preview-72--bp-i18n-specdev.netlify.app/#loc_names_globa
l_audience
[32] https://deploy-preview-72--bp-i18n-specdev.netlify.app/#loc_names_global_audience
r12a: my action, as I understood, was to provide a list of
names people could just pick up and use
… what they need to know is what these weird names come from
… most of the lists of people's names are very European centric
… maybe have Japan and Russia and Turkey and Israel
… but really we want African names, Southeast Asian names, and
so on and so forth
… but for Southeast Asia and China
… I ended up looking at Wikipedia
addison: when we talked to security folks
… they use Alice and Bob
r12a: I guess what I was wondering was
… maybe we could define regions
… I'll ignore North America, but add South America
addison: Africa
r12a: China, Japan
JcK: South America they have cool indigenous names
r12a: not by country, but by large geographical region
… @@
r12a: I'm not dealing with family names
… in Thailand, they use nicknames
addison: seems like a lot of work
… we're writing a baby name finder
atsushi: Vietnamese names
… they use pronunciation clusters
… some of my friends have 3 clusters, some of my friends have 4
clusters
… might be interesting for western people
r12a: same with Chinese names
… starts getting complicated
… at least I need a bit more time
addison: we have three options
… 1. @@
… do we want to make a list?
JcK: i think what we're trying to do is correct
… @@
r12a: and there are cultures where you're not supposed to use
somebody's name
addison: I can make a proposal
AOB?
Summary of action items
1. [33]richard: publish updated rtl languages article
Received on Thursday, 16 June 2022 16:23:57 UTC