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Re: [inline bidi update] - Some comments

From: Richard Ishida <ishida@w3.org>
Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2014 14:01:35 +0000
Message-ID: <52F8DBBF.800@w3.org>
To: Lina Kemmel <LKEMMEL@il.ibm.com>
CC: www-international@w3.org
Hi Lina,

On 09/02/2014 15:28, Lina Kemmel wrote:
> Hi Richard,
>
>>> 2. "if the tightly-wrapped phrase in the previous step is followed
>>> inline (possibly after some intervening neutral characters) by a
>>> number or a logically separate opposite-direction phrase, then add
>>> a directional mark (RLM or LRM) immediately after the markup of that
>>> phrase. " [referring to HTML4]
>>>
>>> Comment: It can be necessary to add a directional mark also before
>>> the markup of the phrase to be isolated. For example, in an LTR
>>> paragraph, an RTL phase to be isolated is dropped from a database
>>> with a directional markup added, but the preceding RTL phrase
>>> doesn't contain such a markup. If the relative order of the 2
>>> successive RTL phrases should be preserved in display (to follow the
>>> LTR base text direction), an LRM character should be inserted before
>>> the injected phrase.
>>>
>> In these cases, the directional mark is still being added after
>> something - just not the thing that was inserted. I think that if you
>> have a problem, you should be able to figure this out from the general
>> rule given, and so it's best to keep the rule simple.
>
> I meant a case when a directional mark is *not* added after the
> preceding text.
> Directional isolates may affect reordering of the entire paragraph and
> I think they don't always have to accompany opposite-direction phrases
> (but only when there is a need for actual isolation, excellent
> examples of which are given in your article).
>
>>> 3. General comment on changing the dir semantics in the HTML
>>> standard itself.
>
>> bdi is useful for text that is inserted into content where you don't
>> know the direction of the inserted text, since it guesses that
>> direction for you. It is can be convenient when you need to add
>> markup, since it's simpler to write <bdi> than <span dir=auto>.
>
> Yes, it seems to me that *dir* in its new role is not necessary...
> But what is more important, I think, is that HTML5 doesn't suggest any
> markup to express U+202A LEFT-TO-RIGHT EMBEDDING /
> U+202B RIGHT-TO-LEFT EMBEDDING ... U+202C POP DIRECTIONAL FORMATTING.

The point is, why would you want to do that anyway for new content?

RI
Received on Monday, 10 February 2014 14:02:08 UTC

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