W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > www-html@w3.org > May 2007

Re: Cleaning House

From: Tina Holmboe <tina@greytower.net>
Date: Sun, 6 May 2007 22:36:45 +0200 (CEST)
To: Murray Maloney <murray@muzmo.com>
cc: www-html@w3.org, public-html@w3.org
Message-ID: <tkrat.236d511bda750286@greytower.net>

On  6 May, Murray Maloney wrote:

> At 12:04 PM 5/6/2007 +0200, Tina Holmboe wrote:
>>On Sat, May 05, 2007 at 08:41:23PM -0400, Murray Maloney wrote:
>> > From the June 1993 Internet Draft for HTML:
>> > http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/draft-ietf-iiir-html-01.txt
>> >
>> > STRONG        Stronger emphasis, typically bold.
>> > B               Boldface, where available, otherwise alternative
>> > mapping allowed.
>> > EM              Emphasis, typically italic.
>> > I               Italic font (or slanted if italic unavailable).
>>   Yes. Even that text prove my point.
> If you are only intent on being RIGHT, then I encourage you to feel
> righteous. Go for it. Don't bother to try to see beyond your own point
> of view. That might be too much like considering another point of
> view.

  All right. So, put bluntly, if my point of view is /different/ from
  yours, and I defend it, then /I/ don't want to consider others, but
  when /you/ do the same ... you are right?

  I /have/ looked at this from multiple angles. The I-element still
  doesn't convey semantics. Have /you/ tried to study /your/ point of
  view lately?

> If you use your own mind for a moment, you will see that none of the 
> descriptions

  That is before you degraded the conversation to insults. If you use
  /your/ own mind for a moment, you will see that it doesn't matter
  which font is used. The I-element has no semantic value. The
  EM-element has.

>>   No. In HTML *in the wild* the I-element is used for italics,
>>   without thought or reason.
> There is evidence of <i> being used with thought and reason.
> There is no evidence of <em> being used with greater thought and
> reason.

  If you actually care to study the raw material you will find the
  statement above incorrect. How many HTML-pages not written by yourself
  have you studied the last year?

> Italic text is emphasized.

  No. Italic text might be used to communicate emphasis. It certainly
  doesn't do so in speech!

> Emphasized terms are presented in italics.

  No. Emphasized terms /may/ be presented in italics. They certain are
  not so in speech!

  The /font style/ is of no importance to the /meaning/ of the element,
  no matter how much an emphasized term is /in certain contexts/
  rendered in an italic font.

  You can render en EM as polka-dotted cubes on a puke-green background,
  and the content will /still/ be "an emphasized term".

 -       Tina Holmboe                           Greytower Technologies
       tina@greytower.net                      http://www.greytower.net
        +46 708 557 905
Received on Sunday, 6 May 2007 20:36:56 UTC

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