RE: Other controls ? Grid ?

Let us know the outcome of your experimentation - i.e. like to know how it
works w/XTab tools.

-Tony
Antonio Luz
SID - UICI
972-233-8200 ext. 6613
800-767-0700 ext. 6613
Fax 800-506-9278

The information contained in this email message is intended only for
use of the individual or entity named above. If the reader of this message
is not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible to
deliver it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any
dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly
prohibited.  If you have received this communication in error, 
notify UICI by telephone (972-233-8200), and destroy the original message. 




> -----Original Message-----
> From:	Dan Dennedy [SMTP:DDennedy@digitalbang.com]
> Sent:	Friday, February 01, 2002 9:52 AM
> To:	Kit Davies; DESEYNE Jacques; www-forms@w3.org
> Subject:	RE: Other controls ? Grid ?
> 
> Yes, I was thinking that a constrained device may need to present a table
> one column at a time and a way to let the user choose a column. Or,
> perhaps it portrays one row at a time with each cell in a list or spoken.
>  
> The XForms repeat structures and related actions go a long way towards
> fulfilling the basics of accomplishing the same goals as a grid control.
> I'll have to do some experimentation to see if I can make my XForms
> processor do the same things as my XTab tool. In particular, for HTML
> browsers, I need to figure out how to align multiple items per repeated
> instance to give a nice tabular appearance. 
> 
> 	-----Original Message-----
> 	From: Kit Davies [mailto:KDavies@categoric.com]
> 	Sent: Friday, February 01, 2002 10:14 AM
> 	To: Dan Dennedy; DESEYNE Jacques; www-forms@w3.org
> 	Subject: RE: Other controls ? Grid ?
> 	
> 	
> 
> 	Hi Dan, 
> 
> 	I believe XForms was designed to abstract the interface intention
> from it's visual or audible implementation. The problem is that visual
> forms are very 2-dimensional so tables fit easily, but voice 'forms' are
> very 1-dimensional sequential objects. So the question is how do you
> represent the intention of a 2-dimensional table in an abstract way. One
> way would be a list of lists (which after all is how tabular is normally
> represented in XML and XForms is XML). So if tables can be implemented by
> lists (and vice versa) and XForms has lists, I suggest that's problem
> solved.
> 
> 	Kit 
> 
> 	-----Original Message----- 
> 	From: Dan Dennedy [ <mailto:DDennedy@digitalbang.com>] 
> 	Sent: 01 February 2002 14:48 
> 	To: Kit Davies; DESEYNE Jacques; www-forms@w3.org 
> 	Subject: RE: Other controls ? Grid ? 
> 
> 
> 	A grid is essentially a table. A table can be as little as a single
> column, also known as a list. Are you implying that lists are unusable in
> diverse environments? I believe what you are describing is a design or
> implementation issue, and not an issue with the paradigm of information
> presented in a tabular manner. 
> 
> 	-----Original Message----- 
> 	From: Kit Davies [ <mailto:KDavies@categoric.com>] 
> 	Sent: Friday, February 01, 2002 9:19 AM 
> 	To: 'DESEYNE Jacques'; www-forms@w3.org 
> 	Subject: RE: Other controls ? Grid ? 
> 
> 
> 	Jacques, 
> 	I work for a company writing software which communicates with users
> over a wide range of devices/channels. Grids are great for fairly large
> visual interfaces, but I find their use becomes more difficult the smaller
> the visual area gets. Plus they are completely unusable when working with
> non-visual interfaces (voice browsers, etc) which were also part of the
> XForms remit.
> 
> 	Modularised XHTML is a better bet. This allows the minimum
> capabilities required by a browser to be stated in a form. Then a
> user/browser can pick the one best suited for the device, using grids if
> possible, or some other design if not.
> 
> 	Kit 
> 	-----Original Message----- 
> 	From: DESEYNE Jacques [ <mailto:jacques.deseyne@swift.com>] 
> 	Sent: 01 February 2002 08:46 
> 	To: www-forms@w3.org 
> 	Subject: Other controls ? Grid ? 
> 
> 
> 	All, 
> 	From my lecture of the current Last Call draft (I've discovered
> XForms only very recently), it would seem that an XForms specification is
> not really intended to provide a framework for generic User Interfaces. It
> lacks several controls commonly found in widely-used GUI "foundation
> classes". 
> 
> 	Among other things, one 'control' we frequently need is a kind of
> grid or table, to present a set of tuples. In principle, it would be
> possible to mimic a grid by repeat structures, but the appearance and
> behaviour will be slightly different, in the best case. Of course, one
> could always envision to make her/his own non-standard extensions... 
> 
> 	Maybe I am missing something and I should apologise for not having
> read some requirements document, but what was the motivation to limit the
> defined controls to more or less what is already available in HTML forms ?
> 
> 
> 	Best regards, 
> 	-- 
> 	Jacques Deseyne 
> 	Society for Worldwide Interbank Financial Telecommunication
> (S.W.I.F.T.) 
> 	SWIFTAlliance WebStation Development Team - IT/Interfaces 
> 	<http://www.swift.com> 
> 	This e-mail and any attachments thereto may contain information that
> is 
> 	confidential and/or proprietary and is intended for the sole use of 
> 	the recipient(s) named above. It is not intended to create or affect
> 
> 	any contractual arrangements between the parties. If you have
> received 
> 	this e-mail by mistake, please notify the sender and delete it
> immediately. 
> 	Thank you for your cooperation. 
> 	  
>

Received on Friday, 1 February 2002 11:01:20 UTC