Re: HTML 5 Accessibility Mappings

Another option is to go through the HTML elements and attributes and define aria role/states/properties for all where appropriate, adding these to aria 1.1

Meaning that all the required semantics can be uniformly described via ARIA

Regards
Steve

Sent from my iPhone

On 28 Jan 2011, at 18:42, Richard Schwerdtfeger <schwer@us.ibm.com> wrote:

> David, 
> 
> The point being that today you need an ARIA role to be able to apply aria attributes. Yet, HTML 5 defines default ARIA semantics for many of the elements removing the need for the author to define an aria role to apply the aria attributes that are applicable to that role. If the author overrides the role using role="foo" then that replaces the role. So there is no reason for the author to expose roles separately if for all HTML elements that don't have a pre-defined ARIA semantic we simply pass the role value as the tag name. 
> 
> I don't see the value for providing the DOM element tag name and the role attribute. Perhaps I am missing something. Are you asking the AT to correct an author error? 
> 
> What I am proposing would actually reduce the number of object attributes as you don't need to pass the tag name and the role - just the role. 
> 
> Rich 
> 
> Rich Schwerdtfeger
> CTO Accessibility Software Group 
> 
> 
> 
> From:        David Bolter <david.bolter@gmail.com> 
> To:        Richard Schwerdtfeger/Austin/IBM@IBMUS 
> Cc:        Steve Faulkner <faulkner.steve@gmail.com>, wai-xtech@w3.org 
> Date:        01/25/2011 03:12 PM 
> Subject:        Re: HTML 5 Accessibility Mappings 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Rich,
> 
> Thanks for posting this.
> 
> Note gecko exposes a 'tag', 'element-name' pair already so the (corrected) #3 would imply duplicated object attributes. I think I would like to expose the role and the element name separately so that AT can decide on its own workarounds. I'm open for debate on that.
> 
> I'm not how "What this does for the author is it allows the author to supply ARIA states and properties to elements that do not have a role supplied but depend on the native ARIA semantics as defined by the HTML 5 specification." is strictly dependent on what we expose via the object attribute. It seems like a separate issue.
> 
> Note for number 4, gecko almost always overrides the element->desktop role mapping and trusts the author. We don't really validate the role attribute against the element name. Having both the role and tag object attributes allows the AT to decide what is best. I realize there are pros and cons to this design.
> 
> The proposal seems to be heading towards using object attributes as the new defacto API (why bother with our existing enumerated MSAA/IA2 roles) for browsers. I like the idea of having a more flexible extensible API. Overall I have had push back from devs like Jamie (NVDA) about overusing the object attributes, so I'm interested to hear his feedback on this thread.
> 
> Cheers,
> David
> 
> On 25/01/11 3:45 PM, Richard Schwerdtfeger wrote: 
> Yes Steve. Thank you for the correction.
> 
> 
> Rich Schwerdtfeger
> CTO Accessibility Software Group
> 
> <mime-attachment.gif>Steve Faulkner ---01/25/2011 10:50:13 AM---Hi Rich, you wrote:
> 
> From: Steve Faulkner <faulkner.steve@gmail.com>
> To: Richard Schwerdtfeger/Austin/IBM@IBMUS
> Cc: wai-xtech@w3.org, david.bolter@gmail.com
> Date: 01/25/2011 10:50 AM
> Subject: Re: HTML 5 Accessibility Mappings
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Rich, 
> 
> you wrote:
> 
> 3. For HTML elements that have default ARIA role semantic we pass the HTML element name as the role in the name value pair passed in the object attributes sent to the AT
> 
> shouldn't this be? 
> 
> "For HTML elements that have NO default ARIA role semantic..." 
> 
> regards
> stevef
> 
> On 25 January 2011 16:40, Richard Schwerdtfeger <schwer@us.ibm.com> wrote: 
> In HTML 5 we introduce the concept of native host language semantics in terms of ARIA roles for all HTML elements. I would like to propose the following
> 
> 1. All HTML elements should provide a role attribute in the corresponding accessible object through the object attributes (such as in IAccessible2)
> 2. For HTML elements that have an ARIA equivalent role that role should be passed as the role name/value pair in the object attributes unless the author overrides the default elements role in the object attribute
> 3. For HTML elements that have default ARIA role semantic we pass the HTML element name as the role in the name value pair passed in the object attributes sent to the AT
> 4. For HTML elements with an allowable ARIA role attribute that is provided by the author we pass that role as the role attribute in the object attributes
> 
> What this does for the author is it allows the author to supply ARIA states and properties to elements that do not have a role supplied but depend on the native ARIA semantics as defined by the HTML 5 specification.
> 
> A case in point:
> 
> <table tabindex="0" role="grid" aria-activedescendant="idx">
> <tr>
> <th>vegetables</th><th>fruits</th> ...
> </tr>
> <td id="idx" role="gridcell">broccoli</td><td role="gridcell>apple</td> ...
> </tr>
> </table> 
> 
> 
> TR has a native host language ARIA semantic of "row" but no role is needed.
> <TH> defeaults to columnheader and so on.
> 
> Feedback?
> 
> Rich Schwerdtfeger
> CTO Accessibility Software Group 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> with regards
> 
> Steve Faulkner
> Technical Director - TPG
> 
> www.paciellogroup.com | www.HTML5accessibility.com | www.twitter.com/stevefaulkner
> HTML5: Techniques for providing useful text alternatives - dev.w3.org/html5/alt-techniques/
> Web Accessibility Toolbar - www.paciellogroup.com/resources/wat-ie-about.html 
>