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Re: Proposal for modifying checkpoint 4.17 (Issue 405)

From: Al Gilman <asgilman@iamdigex.net>
Date: Wed, 13 Dec 2000 19:25:51 -0500
Message-Id: <200012140025.TAA243402@smtp2.mail.iamworld.net>
To: Jon Gunderson <jongund@ux1.cso.uiuc.edu>
Cc: w3c-wai-ua@w3.org
At 01:32 PM 2000-12-13 -0600, Jon Gunderson wrote:
>Basically from my point of view, if there is choice between using selection 
>or focus color use the focus color.  If there is a choice between selection 
>and focus border styles use the focus border style.  If selection uses 
>border styling and focus doesn't use border styling there is no conflict 
>that the priority rule would need to decide on.  In this case the selection 
>border could still be rendered on an item with both selection and focus.
>Is this what you want to say?

That's a little more specific than I wanted to say, but it is very similar.

I would want to give the User Agent free rein to invent creative ways to
combine the selected effects.  If the User Agent developer decides to punt on
combining certain effects, then they can resort to the priority and favor the
presentation effects associated with focus.

[more below]

>Is there a way that this can be more clearly stated in the checkpoint?

Quoting from
Message-Id: <>
archives at: 

4.17 Allow the user to configure how the content focus is highlighted 
(e.g., foreground and background color, voice pitch,
etc.). For graphical viewports, offer at least three rendering options, 
including colors and fonts. For graphical viewports, allow the user to 
select from among the range of system colors and fonts. The default focus 
highlight mechanism must be different from the default selection highlight 
mechanism.  If an element can simultaneously be part of a selection and 
have focus, the focus styling should have priority over the selection 
styling when rendering the element. [Priority 1]

[just take that last sentence]

If an element can simultaneously be part of a selection and have focus, the
focus styling should have priority over the selection styling when rendering
the element.

[Maybe it could say]

When some content is both focused and selected, the user agent should give
priority, if needed to resolve a conflict, to the focus styling over the
selection styling.

[What do others think?]


>At 02:13 PM 12/13/2000 -0500, you wrote:
>>At 12:11 PM 2000-12-13 -0600, Jon Gunderson wrote:
>> >
>> >2. Focus style should have priority over selection style.  No mixing, just
>> >priority.
>> >
>>Please note my concern on this point.  The UA should be allowed or
>>to mix them if it can.  The priority should only be an issue if it can't. 
>>CSS algorithm (pick one style) is bad human engineering in this situation.
>>Lots of the relevant screen effects mix fine.
>>I think that my input on this point is consistent with what Greg Lowney
>>Greg says that the default focus and selection styles should be mixable and
>>mixed when something is both focused and selected.  That is a good idea.  We
>>don't necessarily have to make it a requirement, but we sure shouldn't make
>>It's one thing to say that the UA is not required to mix them and when it
>>it should use the focus style.  It's another to say that the UA should not
>>them but just use the focus style.  To me the latter is writing rules that
>>degrade the communication effectiveness of the tool, which is not our goal,
>>last I checked.
>Jon Gunderson, Ph.D., ATP
>Coordinator of Assistive Communication and Information Technology
>Division of Rehabilitation - Education Services
>College of Applied Life Studies
>University of Illinois at Urbana/Champaign
>1207 S. Oak Street, Champaign, IL  61820
>Voice: (217) 244-5870
>Fax: (217) 333-0248
>E-mail: jongund@uiuc.edu
>WWW: <http://www.staff.uiuc.edu/~jongund>http://www.staff.uiuc.edu/~jongund
>WWW: <http://www.w3.org/wai/ua>http://www.w3.org/wai/ua
Received on Wednesday, 13 December 2000 19:25:42 UTC

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