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Raw minutes from 7 September UA Guidelines meeting

From: Ian Jacobs <ij@w3.org>
Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 16:14:06 -0400
Message-ID: <39B7F70E.9BBBC05@w3.org>
To: w3c-wai-ua@w3.org
7 September 2000 UA Guidelines Teleconference

 Jon Gunderson (Chair)
 Ian Jacobs (Scribe)
 Denis Anson
 Mickey Quenzer
 Eric Hansen
 Harvey Bingham
 Dick Brown
 Tim Lacy
 Gregory Rosmaita
 David Poehlman

 Jim Allan

 Rich Schwerdtfeger
 Kitch Barnicle 
 Charles McCathieNevile

Next meeting: 14 September

Minutes of previous meeting:

JG: Who would be available for additional teleconfs 12th and 19th
(1:30pm - 2:30 ET). 

Yes: DB, TL (12th), MQ, EH, JG, IJ, HB, GR
No: DA


1.Issue 297: Style vs. content and background sounds

 Proposed resolution: 

 /* IJ reviews proposal */

 IJ: I don't think that notification is required here (for non-rendered
     content) since the user has configured the user agent not to
     render some content.

 MQ: I want indication, though, that this particular page has content
     that I'm not hearing. 

 IJ: So change the proposal from "don't play" to "don't play without
     explicit user request."

 DA: I am uncomfortable with the three-second parameter. E.g., I
     may have an online dictionary and need words pronounced at
     a slower rate.e
 JG: Is length a big deal to you, Tim?

 TL: We won't look at how long the sound is. We'll give complete
     control of all sounds. I don't see the utility of the extra

 GR: Media players should be able to compute the length of
     a clip.

 IJ: There's an issue of user interface: it may be annoying to
     get a media player for very short information. By the time
     a media player appears, the sound is over.

 IJ: Does anybody feel strongly about keeping the "3 seconds" part?

 EH: I think that for short sounds, you might not want the
     full-blown media player.

 MQ: If you have a short media clip, you don't want the player.

 IJ: I would note a possible error in the proposal, there's no
     P1 requirement to stop non-style sound.

 EH: I'm in favor of a lower priority for repair functions. We should
     spend less time on repair and more time on WCAG conformance.

   - For audio, video, animation
     control funtionalities, distinguish P1 for content 
     that's not style and P2 for content that's style.

 DA: As for automatic rendering, I think people should be able to
     play on demand.

 IJ: It's a new requirement to say "For sounds specified by
     the author to play automatically, don't play them automatically 
     but allow the user play them manually.

 DA: We are trying to help people with cognitive disabilities and
     also people who are using sound output.

 IJ: Note that we don't have a requirement for turning images
     on individually after a global configuration to not render them.

 IJ: We don't have a requirement that says "Whenever the user agent
     is configured to not render something, let the user know that
     something hasn't been rendered." How would such a requirement
     interact with checkpoint 2.1?

 IJ: How about a checkpoint that says "If the user agent
     recognizes but does not support, or is configured not to
     support some content, indicate this to the user."

 EH: What about style and decoration? Would that be a requirement
     as well (e.g., at a lower priority level).

 IJ: Suppose you turn off style sheets. Does the UA have to tell
     the user that there might be some generated content from
     the style sheet?

 IJ: I don't think individual placeholders are required for all
     content. For instance, for scripts and style sheets, I think
     global indication of presence suffices. For images, audio, etc.,
     placeholders would be useful.

   a) Automatically rendering of audio, video, animations.
      ia) Don't play and don't notify?
      ib) Don't play and notify individually?
      ic) Don't play and notify globally?
     iia) Prompt before playing globally?
     iib) Prompt before playing individually?
    iiia) Don't play, notify, allow manual access globally?
    iiib) Don't play, notify, allow manual access individually?

   DA: All or nothing options are not accessible to many people. 

   IJ: For the case of images, what's the P1 requirement to turn
       off globally, and then access one-by-one? 
   DA: P1 for images - cognitive requirement to be able to 
       turn off the bulk of images and then turn on piece-by-piece.

   b) Notification that some content is recognized but not processed
      or rendered.

   - For checkpoints 3.1, 3.2, 3.3, 3.9, and applets.
     a) Don't render these content types automatically.
     b) Include a requirement for a configuration to notify
        the user that some content not rendered locally. 
     c) Allow the user to render each element manually without
        having to change the configuration.

  IJ: I suspect we're going to merge G3 and G4 as the focus shifts
      from "global" to "automatic".

   - For checkpoint 3.5:
     a) Render as motionless image.
     b) Include a requirement for a configuration to notify
        the user that some content not rendered locally. 
     c) Allow the user to view each animation without
        having to change the configuration.

  - For scripts, turn off and notify user that there globally.

  /* Back to the three seconds question */

  IJ: User agents could allow fast forward of short content, but
      it doesn't help anyone. 

  JG: But they won't want to make the distinction between three
      seconds and two hours unless they know that all their sound
      will be less than 3 seconds.

  DA: I think there's a different between alerts and other
      types of content.

  IJ: I think that the primary reason to include something like
      a three-second limit is to say to readers that we have
      considered this issue and that we know that it does *not*
      benefit users with disabilities to allow users to fast
      forward short sounds. Developers may or may not wish to
      allow control for things that are shorter than three 

  GR: Allow configuration of time interval, with minimum of
      three seconds?

  IJ: Please note that the issue here is not about opening
      viewports or not; that's covered by 4.17.

Action IJ: Repropose checkpoints for G3 and G4 related to
      audio, video, animation that takes into account:
  a) automatic rendering
  b) style v. non style
  c) three seconds. 

Ian Jacobs (jacobs@w3.org)   http://www.w3.org/People/Jacobs
Tel:                         +1 831 457-2842
Cell:                        +1 917 450-8783
Received on Thursday, 7 September 2000 16:14:08 UTC

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