- From: <kerscher@montana.com>
- Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2021 07:54:32 -0600
- To: "'Peter Weil'" <peter.weil@wisc.edu>, "'Bryan Garaventa'" <bryan.garaventa@levelaccess.com>, "'Louise Lister'" <Louise.Lister@iop.org>, <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>, <kerscher@montana.com>
- Message-ID: <000001d78613$a3065200$e912f600$@montana.com>
Hello, Thanks for pointing out needed improvements. Matt has updated. From: Matt Sent: Saturday, July 31, 2021 5:08 AM To: kerscher@montana.com Subject: RE: Good accessibility practice for handling footnotes FYI, I’ve updated the page with the new tagging recommendation. I’ve also added a FAQ entry explaining that the doc-endnote role is no longer recommended.[1] [1] https://kb.daisy.org/publishing/docs/html/notes.html#faq-endnote-dep Matt From: kerscher@montana.com <mailto:kerscher@montana.com> <kerscher@montana.com <mailto:kerscher@montana.com> > Sent: July 30, 2021 7:45 PM To: 'Matt Subject: FW: Good accessibility practice for handling footnotes Hi Matt, Sent this thread to your (our) KB article on notes. Question below. Best George From: Peter Weil <peter.weil@wisc.edu <mailto:peter.weil@wisc.edu> > Sent: Friday, July 30, 2021 4:30 PM To: 'Bryan Garaventa' <bryan.garaventa@levelaccess.com <mailto:bryan.garaventa@levelaccess.com> >; 'Louise Lister' <Louise.Lister@iop.org <mailto:Louise.Lister@iop.org> >; w3c-wai-ig@w3.org <mailto:w3c-wai-ig@w3.org> ; kerscher@montana.com <mailto:kerscher@montana.com> Subject: RE: Good accessibility practice for handling footnotes Thanks George. I like seeing stuff like this (something must be wrong with me ;-) ) One question, though. Wouldn’t the endnote role in the list items result in invalid html, since the <ol> element doesn’t contain an <li> element? I don’t think you can have an empty <ol> element sitting there. Peter -- Peter Weil, Web Developer University Marketing University of Wisconsin–Madison peter.weil@wisc.edu <mailto:peter.weil@wisc.edu> (m) 608-220-3089 On Jul 30, 2021, 5:15 PM -0500, kerscher@montana.com <mailto:kerscher@montana.com> <kerscher@montana.com <mailto:kerscher@montana.com> >, wrote: Hello, I suggest checking out the DAISY Knowledge Base on this issue. http://kb.daisy.org/publishing/docs/html/notes.html Let me know if this helps. Best George From: Bryan Garaventa <bryan.garaventa@levelaccess.com <mailto:bryan.garaventa@levelaccess.com> > Sent: Friday, July 30, 2021 1:23 PM To: Peter Weil <peter.weil@wisc.edu <mailto:peter.weil@wisc.edu> >; Louise Lister <Louise.Lister@iop.org <mailto:Louise.Lister@iop.org> >; w3c-wai-ig@w3.org <mailto:w3c-wai-ig@w3.org> Subject: RE: Good accessibility practice for handling footnotes Hi, Yes of course. The aria-description attribute is sort of a special case, in that it is scheduled to be added to the ARIA spec because it is needed to handle setting the description property in the accessibility tree without having to reference external elements, much like aria-label does, however it has already been added to the mainstream desktop browsers (Chrome and Firefox) to support it. As a result, when tabbing in these browsers using JAWS or NVDA, it will announce the associated description when the numerical footnote link receives focus. Though this is not yet support in Safari in iOS, the footnote link still makes sense in context when swiping left and right with one finger. As a side note, setting aria-description=” “ will do the opposite and clear the description property in the accessibility tree, even if the element includes a title attribute. The aria-flowto attribute is present simply to add an additional layer of navigation for supporting Ats. When using JAWS for example, you can arrow to a footnote link and press the = key to jump directly to the flowed-to element, and Shift+= to go backwards irrespective of which element has focus. Such users have the option of using this method for navigation or pressing Enter to jump manually within the page using standard focus management. The aria-controls attribute is present because aria-flowto won’t actually work without it. 😊 All the best, Bryan Bryan Garaventa Principal Accessibility Architect Level Access, Inc. <mailto:Bryan.Garaventa@LevelAccess.com> Bryan.Garaventa@LevelAccess.com 415.624.2709 (o) <http://www.levelaccess.com/> www.LevelAccess.com From: Peter Weil <peter.weil@wisc.edu <mailto:peter.weil@wisc.edu> > Sent: Friday, July 30, 2021 10:36 AM To: Louise Lister <Louise.Lister@iop.org <mailto:Louise.Lister@iop.org> >; w3c-wai-ig@w3.org <mailto:w3c-wai-ig@w3.org> ; Bryan Garaventa <bryan.garaventa@levelaccess.com <mailto:bryan.garaventa@levelaccess.com> > Subject: RE: Good accessibility practice for handling footnotes CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the organization. Do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe. This is really interesting, Bryan. Thanks for sharing. I’d like to learn more about this solution. How is screenreader support for aria-description? What exactly is aria-flowto used for? Also, what is the purpose of aria-controls here? Thanks, Peter -- Peter Weil, Web Developer University Marketing University of Wisconsin–Madison peter.weil@wisc.edu <mailto:peter.weil@wisc.edu> (m) 608-220-3089 On Jul 30, 2021, 11:21 AM -0500, Bryan Garaventa <bryan.garaventa@levelaccess.com <mailto:bryan.garaventa@levelaccess.com> >, wrote: Hi, When I was developing the footnotes design pattern for Apex, I did a lot of experimentation with different combinations and finally settled on a combination of standard focus control plus ARIA to increase navigation options for AT users. http://whatsock.com/Templates/Footnotes/Internal/index.htm It has no accessibility issues that I can find. Please let me know how this works for you. All the best, Bryan Bryan Garaventa Principal Accessibility Architect Level Access, Inc. <mailto:Bryan.Garaventa@LevelAccess.com> Bryan.Garaventa@LevelAccess.com 415.624.2709 (o) <http://www.levelaccess.com/> www.LevelAccess.com From: Louise Lister <Louise.Lister@iop.org <mailto:Louise.Lister@iop.org> > Sent: Thursday, July 29, 2021 8:05 AM To: w3c-wai-ig@w3.org <mailto:w3c-wai-ig@w3.org> Subject: Good accessibility practice for handling footnotes CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the organization. Do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe. Hello all, I just wondered if there was an approved good practice for the use of accessible footnotes. We have some articles on our website that carry footnotes (currently numbered) that point to links further down the page. Currently, a typical fragment looks a bit like this: <p>Content in here<a href="#_ftn2" title="">[2]</a>.</p> Then the footnote further down the page: <div> <p class="MsoFootnoteText"><a href="#_ftnref2" title="">[2]</a> the content source web link</p> Would using the aria-describedby attribute as detailed by this writer be the best way forward? See https://www.sitepoint.com/accessible-footnotes-css/ I am guessing this scenario would affect research and education websites like ours rather than being a more general requirement. If anyone can advise that would be great and then I can look at making it so (Jean-Luc Picard style). Thank you, and sorry about all my questions! With kind regards, Louise _____ This email (and attachments) are confidential and intended for the addressee(s) only. If you are not the intended recipient please immediately notify the sender, permanently and securely delete any copies and do not take action with it or in reliance on it. 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Received on Saturday, 31 July 2021 13:55:21 UTC