Re: Seeking feedback on IAAP certification roadmap

Kelly,

It sounds like there is some room for improvement in a few instances of the
IAAP alt text. Thank you for pointing them out. I'll pass them on so they
can be improved.

Your analysis of the alt text is sound, and you don't have to apologize for
critically analyzing the accessibility of the web site of an organization
about accessibility.

Your point about alt text being subjective is true too. We haven't written
the test yet, so I can't say exactly how alt text will be handled. Our goal
is to make the certification exam challenging, but not with trick
questions. We want the questions to reflect actual knowledge of best
practices. If a question is too subjective, it won't be included in the
exam. But there will likely be some questions asking test-takers to judge
between good alt text and better alt text. That seems like a reasonable
task. It's still too soon to talk about specific exam questions, since the
exam doesn't exist yet, but we'll do our best to make the exam a valid
assessment, without resorting to trick questions or questions with
ambiguous answers.


Paul Bohman, PhD
Director of Training
Deque Systems, Inc
www.deque.com
703-225-0380, ext.121


On Fri, Apr 11, 2014 at 9:32 PM, Kelly Ford <kelly@kellford.com> wrote:

> Hello,
>
>
>
> I am asking this question here because I think it is an interesting
> question related to both the general topic of web accessibility and how
> certification is to be evaluated.  I recognize that alt-text is subjective
> to some degree but this is the second instance of alt text from an IAAP
> publication that I find lacking in completeness.  And I wonder how
> certification will handle this sort of situation or about other
> perspectives.
>
>
>
> Visiting http://www.accessibilityassociation.org/content.asp?contentid=163I find the following alt text for a picture on the page:
>
>
>
> “Pyramid depicting the expert, professional and associate levels of
> certification”
>
>
>
> I find the alt text lacking because it gives me no idea of how the pyramid
> is actually structured in terms of what’ builds on what.  And even from a
> writing perspective what I’m told is at the lowest level of the pyramid by
> someone who can see, namely associate, appears as the last item in the alt
> text.  Now the text explanation further on would appear to put things in
> the same order as they are depicted in the graphic.  That and my own
> judgment can likely tell me more about how the picture is structured but in
> my opinion I shouldn’t be required to do this level of analysis if I’m
> using alt text as my method of image perception.  And an equally valid
> argument might be made that just from a writing perspective expert is what
> should appear first.
>
>
>
> The first instance of alt text that could have been better,, again in my
> subjective opinion, happened in the first community update back in December
> 2013.  For reference purposes this can be found at:
>
>
> http://us7.campaign-archive1.com/?u=c9e95602d3d7209e71c920bfa&id=b3e4fe052c#IntroducingTheIAAPLogo
>
>
>
> There is a full article on the new IAAP logo.  But again from the alt text
> or even the article, I’d have little to no idea of what this logo is, what
> the six colors are and such.  Do I need to know this?  I’d contend yes in
> this case for a new logo being introduced yes.
>
>
>
> The current alt text related to this logo reads:
>
> "Photo of the IAAP logo" and "Photo of the six-color element that makes up
> the international IAAP logo”."
>
>
>
> Now I was curious what the logo looked like and what the colors were so
> did email a contact at the IAAP to ask about the logo.  This is the
> description I was provided.
>
>
>
> “The logo is simply the letters IAAP in the color blue against a white
> background.  How we show those letters is what we were trying to
> communicate.  The two A’s are connected by a curved line that creates the
> cross mark for the A’s.  This curved line connects the two letters together
> both showing our goal of providing a place for professionals to connect
> together and, because the curved line looks somewhat like a bridge,
> reflecting that this is a pathway towards something new.
>
>
>
> The six color element are just six thin blocks of color in a line.  The
> colors used are in this order – red, blue, yellow, purple, green and
> orange.  These colors represent the most common colors used within the
> flags of our international community.”
>
>
>
> I am in no way being critical of the IAAP here.  But I tend to be an
> examples sort of person when it comes to accessibility and am curious how
> again certification would judge a person’s ability to accurately create alt
> text from these examples if a certification test got to that level.
> Imagine for example that a certification question presented these same two
> situations and asked the person to write alt text and then justify the
> reasons behind why they chose what they did.  Obviously without knowing the
> intent behind the chosen alt text here I cannot accurately evaluate intent
> but from a results perspective, were I judging, I’d fail both of these
> cases of alt text or other method of image description.  In the pyramid
> case because the alt text does not convey enough about the image and
> perhaps because the text is out of order with the intent of the picture
>  and in the logo case because either the alt text or the article
> introducing the logo does not give someone who does not see the picture
> enough information for a new logo.
>
>
>
> Again I want to emphasize I am not being critical of the IAAP effort
> here.  In fact I think the industry needs something in this space because
> I, as I suspect do many others, invest an inordinate amount of time
> evaluating the accessibility claims of many because far too often reality
> doesn’t match stated ability.  I will also say that any opinions expressed
> here reflect my personal opinion and are in no way related to any
> professional employment or organizational membership of mine.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
>
> Kelly
>
>
>
> *From:* Paul Bohman [mailto:paul.bohman@deque.com]
> *Sent:* Friday, April 11, 2014 4:09 PM
> *To:* Tony Jasionowski
> *Cc:* David Hilbert Poehlman; Lastort Joanne L [Contractor]; Bob carroll;
> J. Albert Bowden; W3C WAI ig
>
> *Subject:* Re: Seeking feedback on IAAP certification roadmap
>
>
>
> Many people on this list are accessibility professionals, so the
> collective group of you are indeed one of the target audiences of the IAAP.
> In fact, the first certification category that will be developed is in the
> realm of digital accessibility, so right now you are the main target
> audience. If the IAAP branches out later (that's not a given), then it will
> be appropriate to engage with other similar professional groups in those
> areas.
>
>
>
> Paul Bohman, PhD
> Director of Training
> Deque Systems, Inc
> www.deque.com
> 703-225-0380, ext.121
>
>
>
> On Fri, Apr 11, 2014 at 6:46 PM, <Tony.Jasionowski@us.panasonic.com>
> wrote:
>
> Joanne,
> I agree with you that IAAP scope is beyond the scope of this list.
> Tony
>
>
> Tony Jasionowski
> Senior Group Manager Accessibility
> Panasonic Consumer Electronics Company
> Two Riverfront Plaza, 9th Floor
> Newark, NJ 07102
> Email: tony.jasionowski@us.panasonic.com
> Tel/Fax: 201-348-7777
>
>
>
>
>
> From:        David Hilbert Poehlman <poehlman1@comcast.net>
>
> To:        "Tony.Jasionowski@us.panasonic.com" <
> Tony.Jasionowski@us.panasonic.com>,
> Cc:        "Lastort Joanne L [Contractor]" <Joanne.L.Lastort@irs.gov>,
> Bob carroll <accessys@smart.net>, "J. Albert Bowden" <
> jalbertbowden@gmail.com>, Paul Bohman <paul.bohman@deque.com>, W3C WAI ig
> <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
> Date:        04/11/2014 02:26 PM
>
> Subject:        Re: Seeking feedback on IAAP certification roadmap
> ------------------------------
>
>
>
>
> Perhaps then it is too broad to discuss on this list?
>
>
> --
> Jonnie Appleseed
> with his
> Hands-On Technolog(eye)s
> touching the internet
> Reducing technologeyes' disabilities
> one byte at a time
>
> On Apr 11, 2014, at 14:13, Tony.Jasionowski@us.panasonic.com wrote:
>
> Joanne,
> WCAG only relates to web accessibility and not the many other aspects of
> accessibility, which I assume IAAP will address and/or certify. It seems
> the scope of IAAP is intended to be international and cover all aspects of
> accessibility, which is a real challenge.
> Tony
> <mime-attachment.jpg>
> Tony Jasionowski
> Senior Group Manager Accessibility
> Panasonic Consumer Electronics Company
> Two Riverfront Plaza, 9th Floor
> Newark, NJ 07102
> Email: tony.jasionowski@us.panasonic.com
> Tel/Fax: 201-348-7777
>
> <mime-attachment.gif>
>
>
>
>
> From:        "Lastort Joanne L [Contractor]" <Joanne.L.Lastort@irs.gov>
> To:        Paul Bohman <paul.bohman@deque.com>, "
> Tony.Jasionowski@us.panasonic.com" <Tony.Jasionowski@us.panasonic.com>,
> Cc:        Bob carroll <accessys@smart.net>, "J. Albert Bowden" <
> jalbertbowden@gmail.com>, W3C WAI ig <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
> Date:        04/10/2014 09:37 AM
> Subject:        RE: Seeking feedback on IAAP certification roadmap
> ------------------------------
>
>
>
>
> Most countries are aligning themselves with WCAG 2.0 - even the US (at
> least partially). That should help, if you're going to use any kind of
> standard.
>
> Thank you for your help,
>
> Joanne Lastort
> IT Specialist
> 508 Program Office (IRAP)
> 240-613-4681 (new)
> TOD: 8am-4:30pm Eastern
> IRAP Web site: http://irap.web.irs.gov
> Please send all correspondence to *508 (508@irs.gov)
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Paul Bohman [mailto:paul.bohman@deque.com <paul.bohman@deque.com>]
> Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 9:32 AM
> To: Tony.Jasionowski@us.panasonic.com
> Cc: Bob carroll; J. Albert Bowden; W3C WAI ig
> Subject: Re: Seeking feedback on IAAP certification roadmap
>
> Tony,
>
> I agree that localization of laws is complex, but IAAP is international,
> so we can't focus only on US laws.
>
>
>
> Paul Bohman, PhD
> Director of Training
> Deque Systems, Inc
> www.deque.com
> 703-225-0380, ext.121
>
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 9, 2014 at 9:31 PM, <Tony.Jasionowski@us.panasonic.com> wrote:
>
>
>                Folks,
>                There is a wide variation between ADA, CVAA and other
> international accessibility laws, which may not be harmonized. I suggest
> IAAP should focus onto the U.S., since it may be too difficult to encompass
> international certification.
>                Tony
>
>                Tony Jasionowski
>                Senior Group Manager Accessibility
>                Panasonic Consumer Electronics Company
>                Two Riverfront Plaza, 9th Floor
>                Newark, NJ 07102
>                Email: tony.jasionowski@us.panasonic.com
>                Tel/Fax: 201-348-7777
>
>
>
>
>
>
>                From:        Paul Bohman <paul.bohman@deque.com>
>                To:        accessys@smart.net,
>                Cc:        "J. Albert Bowden" <jalbertbowden@gmail.com>,
> W3C WAI ig <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
>                Date:        04/08/2014 08:05 PM
>
>                Subject:        Re: Seeking feedback on IAAP certification
> roadmap
>
> ________________________________
>
>
>
>
>                IAAP certification is not specific to any law, such as the
> ADA. It is for accessibility professionals in a variety of accessibility
> disciplines. Similarly, the IAAP is an international organization, not just
> for American laws.
>
>                It's also important to separate the concept of courses from
> certification. The IAAP will offer a variety of educational resources and
> opportunities which can impart the kind of knowledge necessary to pass
> certification, but the certification itself is an assessment; a test. The
> idea behind certification is to show that the individual has met a certain
> level of expertise in the field, according to industry-accepted
> competencies.
>
>
>                Paul Bohman, PhD
>                Director of Training
>                Deque Systems, Inc
>                www.deque.com <http://www.deque.com/>
>                703-225-0380, ext.121 <tel:703-225-0380%2C%20ext.121<703-225-0380%2C%20ext.121>>
>
>
>
>                On Tue, Apr 8, 2014 at 7:55 PM, <accessys@smart.net <
> mailto:accessys@smart.net <accessys@smart.net>> > wrote:
>
>                when I took the DoJ training back in 1992 they made it very
> clear that there was going to be no accepted "Certification" for ADA, so
> wonder how this sits with the DoJ position or has it changed???
>
>                and how will it relate to DoJ training courses??
>
>                Bob
>
>                On Tue, 8 Apr 2014, J. Albert Bowden wrote:
>
>                Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2014 19:47:40 -0400
>                From: J. Albert Bowden <jalbertbowden@gmail.com <
> mailto:jalbertbowden@gmail.com <jalbertbowden@gmail.com>> >
>                To: Paul Bohman <paul.bohman@deque.com <
> mailto:paul.bohman@deque.com <paul.bohman@deque.com>> >
>                Cc: W3C WAI ig <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org <mailto:w3c-wai-ig@w3.org<w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>>
> >
>                Subject: Re: Seeking feedback on IAAP certification roadmap
>                Resent-Date: Tue, 08 Apr 2014 23:48:09 +0000
>                Resent-From: w3c-wai-ig@w3.org <mailto:w3c-wai-ig@w3.org<w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>>
>
>
>
>                does it cost money to get certified?
>
>
>
>                On Tue, Apr 8, 2014 at 1:15 PM, Paul Bohman <
> paul.bohman@deque.com <mailto:paul.bohman@deque.com<paul.bohman@deque.com>>
> > wrote:
>
>                Cross posted request for feedback:
>
>                The International Association of Accessibility
> Professionals (IAAP) needs
>                your feedback on our roadmap for accessibility
> certification. Here is the
>                roadmap as it stands now:
>
>
> http://www.accessibilityassociation.org/content.asp?contentid=163 <
> http://www.accessibilityassociation.org/content.asp?contentid=163>
>
>                We are still in the early stages of designing the
> certification, so your
>                feedback is most valuable now, before we commit to a
> certain path.
>
>                Here are some questions to consider as you read the roadmap:
>
>                   1. What do you think of the roadmap overall?
>                   2. What would you do to improve our roadmap?
>                   3. What do you think of the *levels* of certification
> outlined in the
>                   roadmap?
>                   4. Are there any broad *Knowledge Domains and Roles*
> that we have left
>
>                   off that should be included?
>                   5. Do you like our list of *Digital Accessibility* areas
> of
>
>                   certification? Should we add to or subtract from this
> list? (For example,
>                   one person commented that we should add gaming to the
> list.)
>                   6. Do you like the idea of certifying for these areas
> separately, in a
>                   modular approach as we have done? (See the section on
> *Referencing
>                   IAAP Credentials* for an explanation of how this might
> work)
>                   7. Do you like the 3 year period for certification?
> Would you make it
>
>                   shorter (2 years) or longer (5 years)?
>                   8. What kind of certification assessment would you
> create? Keep in
>
>                   mind that it has to be a valid and meaningful test of
> the right kind of
>                   competencies, it must be challenging enough that novices
> could not pass it
>                   without first studying or gaining experience,  it must
> be scalable (not too
>                   burdensome to administer or grade/score the assessment),
> and translatable
>                   into other languages.
>                   9. Once certification becomes available, do you think
> you would go
>
>                   through the process to become certified? Why or why not?
>                   10. What else should we consider as we move forward?
>
>
>                To give feedback, you can reply directly to this email, or
> you can send an
>                email to the certification committee:
> CC@accessibilityassociation.org <mailto:CC@accessibilityassociation.org<CC@accessibilityassociation.org>>
>
>
>                Paul Bohman, PhD
>                Chair, IAAP Certification Committee
>                Director of Training
>                Deque Systems, Inc
>                www.deque.com <http://www.deque.com/>
>                703-225-0380, ext.121 <tel:703-225-0380%2C%20ext.121<703-225-0380%2C%20ext.121>>
>
>
>
>
>
>                --
>                J. Albert Bowden II
>
>                jalbertbowden@gmail.com <mailto:jalbertbowden@gmail.com<jalbertbowden@gmail.com>>
>
>
>                http://bowdenweb.com/ <http://bowdenweb.com/>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> <Jasionowski_Tony.vcf>
>
>
>