- From: John Foliot <john.foliot@deque.com>
- Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2019 16:44:31 -0500
- To: Michael Gower <michael.gower@ca.ibm.com>
- Cc: Alastair Campbell <acampbell@nomensa.com>, WCAG list <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
- Message-ID: <CAKdCpxzonOZsOnbjHPhGe=8+sJ2DMK5g13DiwAGoLyUE2RcJ7g@mail.gmail.com>
Hi All, I share many of the same thoughts as Jon and Mike do. In particular, Jon's comment "...that is why I think it is more clear to have different versions of the SC that build on each other to help enforce that." - A huge +1 I've personally always seen "backward comparability" to also equal "we're building on top of", and as Mike has illustrated, this isn't that un-common for WCAG even at 2.0. in particular, he notes one SC that amply illustrates what I envision here: "...*meet 1.2.8 and you meet 1.2.3..."* JF On Wed, Jul 10, 2019 at 2:51 PM Michael Gower <michael.gower@ca.ibm.com> wrote: > An important consideration is to look at how things happen in WCAG 2.0 > right now, which unfortunately is not consistent. > One thing that is clear is that where a requirement builds directly upon > another, in ALL situations they are at different levels. That's why I think > that considering moving Focus Visible to level A is advisable. It maintains > this stratification. Moving an SC from AA to A has some impacts to tools, > but they don't seem that heavy, and for users it is simple because they > already test for it. > > In regard to the argument around one SC effectively rendering another a > moot point, we have many such subset SCs in place today. Again, they are > ALWAYS differentiated by their levels. > > Subset examples: > > - 1.3.5 Identify Input Purpose AA is a subset of 1.3.6 Identify > Purpose AAA. Meet 1.3.6 and you meet 1.3.5 > - 1.4.3 Contrast (Minimum) AA is a subset of 1.4.6 Contrast (Enhanced) > AAA. Meet 1.4.6 and you meet 1.4.3 > - 1.4.5 Images of Text AA is a subset of 1.4.9 Images of Text (No > Exception) AAA. Meet 1.4.9 and you meet 1.4.5, etc > - 2.1.1 Keyboard A is a subset of 2.1.3 Keyboard (No Exception) AAA > - 2.3.1 Three Flashes or Below Threshold A is a subset of 2.3.2 Three > Flashes AAA > - 2.4.4 Link Purpose (In Context) A is a subset of 2.4.9 Link Purpose > (Link Only) AAA > - 3.3.4 Error Prevention (Legal, Financial, Data) AA to 3.3.6 Error > Prevention (All) AAA > - > > Note that all of the above involve level AAA enhancements. > > - > > Slightly messier is: > > - 1.2.3 Audio Description or Media Alternative A is a subset of 1.2.5 > Audio Description AA, but only for the audio description part. Meet 1.2.5 > and you meet 1.2.3 > - 1.2.3 is also in some contexts ALREADY meeting 1.2.8 AAA (for the > alternative part). Still, meet 1.2.8 and you meet 1.2.3 > > > Non-subset increments include: > > - 1.2.5 Audio Description AA to 1.2.7 Extended Audio Description. > While the inference is there that it is a subset, it is arguably a > different feature depending on a prerequisite. > - 1.2.2 Captions (Prerecorded) A to 1.2.4 Captions (Live) AA. > Different circumstance for captioning. > - 1.2.4 Captions (Live) AA to Audio-only (Live) AAA. Different medium > (synchronized media versus audio-only). > - 3.1.1 Language of Page A to 3.1.2 Language of Parts AA. Cover > different parts of content, although inference is that language of page is > a prerequisite > - 3.3.1 Error Identification A to 3.3.3 Error Suggestion AA. > Additional function, based on same need to automatically detect error. > - > > > It's tough to tackle this entirely in an email, so my feeling is it would > be useful to have a focused discussion on aspects of this. I share > previously expressed sentiments that backwards compatibility does not mean > *identical*. You can enhance prior requirements. No matter how we slice > this, if we are adding a new requirement (whether as a new SC or as an > altered SC) there's going to need to be additional analysis or testing in > the case where someone *fails* the latest version and wants to see if > they still meet the prior one. > > Michael Gower > Senior Consultant in Accessibility > IBM Design > > > 1803 Douglas Street, Victoria, BC V8T 5C3 > gowerm@ca.ibm.com > cellular: (250) 661-0098 * fax: (250) 220-8034 > > > > From: Alastair Campbell <acampbell@nomensa.com> > To: WCAG list <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org> > Date: 2019-06-28 07:42 AM > Subject: [EXTERNAL] WCAG 2.2 - tightened requirements approach > ------------------------------ > > > Hi everyone, > > > > The question I ask at the end of this email is: “Given such a clean > addition of requirements for an SC, what is the downside to modifying the > current SC?” The rest is explanation: > > > > Whilst working on the focus “more” visible SC for WCAG 2.2, there have > been some survey comments on how it fits with the current 2.4.7 [1]. > > > > Suggestions included: > > 1. Add a separate SC at level AA (e.g. Enhanced keyboard focus); > 2. Add a separate SC at level AA (e.g. Enhanced keyboard focus), > and move 2.4.7 to level A; > 3. Modify 2.4.7 to include the new requirements (removing 2.4.7 > and replacing it with this would be the same thing). > > > > In this case it is a straightforward extension on 2.4.7, so *all*the > options maintain backwards compatibility. This email is about *how*to do > it. > > > > *# Option 1 & 2, a separate new SC* > > > > We’d have the current SC, either at level AA or changed to A: > > *2.4.7 Focus Visible (level A or AA)* > > Any keyboard operable user interface has a mode of operation where the > keyboard focus indicator is visible. > > > > *2.4.8*… (level AAA) > > *2.4.9*… (level AAA) > > *2.4.10*… (level AAA) > > > > *2.4.11 Enhanced keyboard focus (level AA)* > > The keyboard focus indicator must: > > - Have a size equivalent to at least a 1 CSS pixel line along the > longest side, and > - have a contrast ratio of at least 3:1 for the change of color > contrast. > > > > > > > > *# Option 3, modify the SC* > > > > In this scenario the current 2.4.7 would be updated to something like this > draft: > > *2.4.7 Focus Visible (level A or AA)* > > Any keyboard operable user interface has a mode of operation where the > keyboard focus indicator is visible. > The visible change that indicates keyboard focus must: > > - Have a size equivalent to at least a 1 CSS pixel line along the > longest side, and > - have a contrast ratio of at least 3:1 for the change of color > contrast. > > > > > > The new part is appended to the end, the original SC text is un-touched. > > > > All the options seem reasonable for the SC text, where I’m struggling is > the understanding document. > > > > I’ve drafted that as an update here: > > > *https://docs.google.com/document/d/1g9_WBgfhViWAaRFIWWt10CP5rBsEVIWm3vT1vWqrHvI/edit?ts=5d124fb5#* > <https://docs.google.com/document/d/1g9_WBgfhViWAaRFIWWt10CP5rBsEVIWm3vT1vWqrHvI/edit?ts=5d124fb5#> > > > > The original understanding doc becomes redundant, both the content and the > techniques attached to it are a sub-set of the new SC. > > > > Of course, we have SCs like Contrast min and contrast enhanced [2], but in > that case the Understanding doc is virtually identical, even the techniques > are the identical. (I’m curious if the group at the time thought of just > pointing in a pointer from one to the other, rather than duplicating the > text?) > > > > In this case there would be conflicting advice between the two > understanding docs, as the current 2.4.7 allows for default indicators and > blinking cursors as focus-indicators. That would then be overridden *at > level AA*by the new SC. Also, technique G156 (default focus indicators) > would be valid for 2.4.7, but not for the new one. > > > > If you remove the conflicting advice from the current 2.4.7 Understanding > doc there wouldn’t by much left, and everything else would be covered the > new SC. > > > > In the case of separate SCs I would be inclined to basically have an > almost blank Understanding doc and just point to the new SC. Which seems > messy & odd. > > > > Given such a clean addition of requirements for an SC, what is the > downside to modifying the current SC? > > > > Having an updated 2.4.7 wouldn’t impact my work at all (compared to a new > separate SC), what am I missing? > > > > Kind regards, > > > > -Alastair > > > > 1] *https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/wcag22reviews/results#xq4* > <https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/wcag22reviews/results#xq4> > > 2] *https://www.w3.org/WAI/WCAG21/Understanding/contrast-minimum.html* > <https://www.w3.org/WAI/WCAG21/Understanding/contrast-minimum.html> > > *https://www.w3.org/WAI/WCAG21/Understanding/contrast-enhanced.html* > <https://www.w3.org/WAI/WCAG21/Understanding/contrast-enhanced.html> > > > > -- > > > > *www.nomensa.com* <http://www.nomensa.com/> > tel: +44 (0)117 929 7333 / 07970 879 653 > follow us: @we_are_nomensa or me: @alastc > Nomensa Ltd. King William House, 13 Queen Square, Bristol BS1 4NT > > > > Company number: 4214477 | UK VAT registration: GB 771727411 > > > -- *John Foliot* | Principal Accessibility Strategist | W3C AC Representative Deque Systems - Accessibility for Good deque.com
Received on Wednesday, 10 July 2019 21:45:49 UTC