Re: Revert Adapting text language replacing "adapt" with "change"

​I'm ok with change or set. ​

Cheers,
David MacDonald



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On Thu, Nov 16, 2017 at 10:54 AM, Laura Carlson <laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com
> wrote:

> Hi Steve, Andrew, Jason, and all,
>
> Thank you, Steve!  At one time we did use the word "set" in some of
> the proposals.
>
> Can anyone not live with Steve's proposal:
>
> "If the technologies being used allow the user agent to set text style
> properties, then no loss of essential content or functionality occurs
> by setting all of the following:"
>
> To replace the November 13 wording:
>
> "If the technologies being used allow the user agent to change text
> style properties, the following can be achieved with no loss of
> essential content or functionality: "
>
> Kindest Regards,
> Laura
>
> On 11/16/17, Repsher, Stephen J <stephen.j.repsher@boeing.com> wrote:
> > Alright, how about just using "set" as the verb then...
> >
> > "If the technologies being used allow the user agent to set text style
> > properties, then no loss of essential content or functionality occurs by
> > setting all of the following:"
> >
> > That should fix that problem, but I'm inclined to say we need the word
> > "only" in there somewhere given the discussion even amongst ourselves
> had to
> > reiterate it.  I had tossed that in there a while back but not sure why
> it
> > was removed and would have to check the GitHub thread.
> >
> > Steve
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: White, Jason J [mailto:jjwhite@ets.org]
> > Sent: Thursday, November 16, 2017 10:44 AM
> > To: Laura Carlson <laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com>; Andrew Kirkpatrick
> > <akirkpat@adobe.com>
> > Cc: WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>; David MacDonald <david@can-adapt.com>;
> > Alastair Campbell <acampbell@nomensa.com>
> > Subject: RE: Revert Adapting text language replacing "adapt" with
> "change"
> >
> > I remain concerned that David's proposal doesn't address Andrew's case in
> > which no "change" is necessary, because the content already meets the
> four
> > requirements listed in the SC. I suppose one could say that there's a
> > trivial null transformation involved (i.e., no change could still be
> treated
> > as a "change"), which is however counter-intuitive and a very subtle -
> > indeed dubious - interpretation of the text.
> >
> > I'm leaning toward saying, no, I can't live with David's revert.
> >
> > Perhaps "ensuring all of the following" would be better, where "ensuring"
> > includes either changing or leaving alone if the author has already met
> the
> > specified thresholds.
> >
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Laura Carlson [mailto:laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com]
> >> Sent: Thursday, November 16, 2017 10:05 AM
> >> To: Andrew Kirkpatrick <akirkpat@adobe.com>
> >> Cc: White, Jason J <jjwhite@ets.org>; WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>; David
> >> MacDonald <david@can-adapt.com>; Alastair Campbell
> >> <acampbell@nomensa.com>
> >> Subject: Re: Revert Adapting text language replacing "adapt" with
> >> "change"
> >>
> >> Hi Andrew,
> >>
> >> Text at the end of our November 13, 2017 meeting:
> >>
> >> "If the technologies being used allow the user agent to change text
> >> style properties, the following can be achieved with no loss of
> >> essential content or
> >> functionality:
> >> * the 4 things
> >>
> >> David's proposed revert [5]:
> >>
> >> "If the technologies being used allow the user agent to change text
> >> style properties, then no loss of essential content or functionality
> >> occurs by changing all of the following:"
> >> * the 4 things
> >>
> >> Thank you.
> >>
> >> Kindest Regards,
> >> Laura
> >>
> >> [5]
> >> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists
> >> .w3.o
> >> rg%2FArchives%2FPublic%2Fw3c-wai-
> >> gl%2F2017OctDec%2F0368.html&data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C700
> >> b333d209b412a9c1a08d52d03766a%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%
> >> 7C0%7C0%7C636464415244080402&sdata=696nDSdTQHKxkuSw3lWGUqVOSX6
> >> eR8l86ZDq3Vgw47Q%3D&reserved=0
> >>
> >> On 11/16/17, Andrew Kirkpatrick <akirkpat@adobe.com> wrote:
> >> > Laura,
> >> > I’m sure that the options were clearly laid out somewhere in the
> >> > thread, but I don’t have time to find it. Can you clearly lay out
> >> > “before” and “proposed” options?
> >> >
> >> > Thanks,
> >> > AWK
> >> >
> >> > Andrew Kirkpatrick
> >> > Group Product Manager, Accessibility Adobe
> >> >
> >> > akirkpat@adobe.com
> >> > https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftwit
> >> > te
> >> >
> >> r.com%2Fawkawk&data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C700b333d209b412
> >> a9c1a
> >> >
> >> 08d52d03766a%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C63646
> >> 4415244
> >> >
> >> 080402&sdata=kszdaxRJsWVstas19rZOJnWmR3UB7bdcevZEcLFajJg%3D&reserv
> >> ed=0
> >> >
> >> > On 11/16/17, 09:56, "Laura Carlson" <laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com>
> >> > wrote:
> >> >
> >> >     Hello everyone,
> >> >
> >> >     I wrote:
> >> >     > Andrew, Jason, and everyone else, can you live with reverting
> the
> >> >     > adapting text language by replacing "adapt" with "change" as
> >> > David
> >> >     > suggested? [5]
> >> >
> >> >     Please let me rephrase that.
> >> >
> >> >     After reviewing the video demonstration, draft technique, and test
> >> >     results can anyone not live with reverting the adapting text
> >> > language
> >> >     by replacing "adapt" with "change" to what David suggested?
> >> >
> >> >     Thank you.
> >> >
> >> >     Best Regards,
> >> >     Laura
> >> >
> >> >     On 11/15/17, Laura Carlson <laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >     > Hello Andrew, Jason, and all,
> >> >     >
> >> >     > Andrew wrote [1]:
> >> >     >> It would help me to understand exactly what steps you
> >> > envision a user
> >> >     >> would need to
> >> >     >> follow to achieve the following four items, and provide an
> >> > example page
> >> >     >> that shows
> >> >     >> this working as you envision it.
> >> >     >
> >> >     > Alastair provided a video demonstration of what a person would
> >> > need to
> >> >     > do to test for the four items on the BBC and Adobe
> >> > homepages.[2] Thank
> >> >     > you, Alastair!
> >> >     >
> >> >     > For that step-by-step process in text, please check our draft
> >> >     > technique "Allowing for Spacing Override". [3]
> >> >     >
> >> >     > For results of the testing that we completed using that
> >> > step-by-step
> >> >     > procedure, please check the "Results of Bookmarklet Tests for
> >> > Issue
> >> >     > 78".[4] Between July 25 and August 3, 2017, 67 pages were
> tested.
> >> > If
> >> >     > the spacing parameters supplied by the author already meets or
> >> > exceeds
> >> >     > the SC's specified metrics, the content passes the test using
> the
> >> >     > bookmarklet.
> >> >     >
> >> >     > Does the video demonstration, draft technique, and test results
> >> >     > provide the clarity needed?
> >> >     >
> >> >     > Andrew, Jason, and everyone else, can you live with reverting
> the
> >> >     > adapting text language by replacing "adapt" with "change" as
> >> > David
> >> >     > suggested? [5]
> >> >     >
> >> >     > Thank you.
> >> >     >
> >> >     > Kindest Regards,
> >> >     > Laura
> >> >     >
> >> >     > [1]
> >> >
> >> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists
> >> .w3.o
> >> rg%2FArchives%2FPublic%2Fw3c-wai-
> >> gl%2F2017OctDec%2F0370.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7Ca5e5bb7503ee418633
> >> a508d52d023100%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636
> >> 464409791358570&sdata=DIMiABzs3Pd1HEAQZI5t%2FQxTAeaXeqyT%2FCwpbB
> >> %2FNnZE%3D&reserved=0
> >> >     > [2]
> >> >
> >> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists
> >> .w3.o
> >> rg%2FArchives%2FPublic%2Fw3c-wai-
> >> gl%2F2017OctDec%2F0373.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7Ca5e5bb7503ee418633
> >> a508d52d023100%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636
> >> 464409791358570&sdata=03fGYgLdaQfwsqHHd0EmAIZloK5iSz3E%2B3NWWLN
> >> 3QEY%3D&reserved=0
> >> >     > [3]
> >> >
> >> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3
> .
> >> org%2FWAI%2FGL%2Fwiki%2FAllowing_for_Spacing_Override&data=02%7C01
> >> %7C%7Ca5e5bb7503ee418633a508d52d023100%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c
> >> 178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636464409791358570&sdata=NejhMNltxv0VwBtv1jIK
> >> s90MuWL39OtfN21DaTPf3X8%3D&reserved=0
> >> >     > [4]
> >> >     >
> >> >
> >> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3
> .
> >> org%2FWAI%2FGL%2Fwiki%2FResults_of_Bookmarklet_Tests_for_Issue_78&da
> >> ta=02%7C01%7C%7Ca5e5bb7503ee418633a508d52d023100%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34
> >> 438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636464409791358570&sdata=tc9Wjhg3
> >> 1KL11sE1TGIKLkx7ghxQtbgnkWbqS3Clcmg%3D&reserved=0
> >> >     > [5]
> >> >
> >> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists
> >> .w3.o
> >> rg%2FArchives%2FPublic%2Fw3c-wai-
> >> gl%2F2017OctDec%2F0368.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7Ca5e5bb7503ee418633
> >> a508d52d023100%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636
> >> 464409791358570&sdata=hNH%2BJRMlEOz9uzbU8JpGlnmg49MxnU8n19Y0JRd
> >> Grp4%3D&reserved=0
> >> >     >
> >> >     > --
> >> >     > Laura L. Carlson
> >> >     >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >     --
> >> >     Laura L. Carlson
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Laura L. Carlson
> >
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> --
> Laura L. Carlson
>