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Re: Semantic Web gTLDs

From: Phil Archer <parcher@icra.org>
Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2005 13:53:38 +0100
Message-ID: <00e301c5cb3e$93c21c30$ee276551@PHILXP>
To: "semantic-web at W3C" <semantic-web@w3c.org>


As Danny and others on this list are aware, my work in recent years has been 
focused on getting more SW data onto the wild woolly web. I was able to say 
a few words about this at one of the feeder conferences for WSIS, a CoE 
event in Strasbourg recently.

My organisation (ICRA) is a child-protection charity developing solutions 
based on metadata and is on record as supporting, for example, the creation 
of the .xxx TLD. (As a member of the W3C Mobile Web Initiative, I work with 
Jo Rabin who represents .mobi in that forum.) However, ICRA emphatically 
does not support the idea that all sites on .xxx should be automatically 
blocked from all children. Our support for it is based on the fact that 
signing up for .xxx means signing up for a code of conduct that, crucially, 
includes providing metadata, specifically including ICRA labels. I hope to 
set up icra.xxx. It wouldn't be an adult site but might be a site about ICRA 
tailored to the adult industry.

The concept of a .semantic TLD doesn't immediately make me feel positive. 
The SW has been slow to take off on the general web because the commercial 
case for adding SW data has been weak and remains so because, as you rightly 
point out, search engines don't use it due to past experiences with spoofs 
of various kinds.

So it comes down to trust. If you can trust the SW data, _then_ you can use 
it in search, classification, categorisation, filtering, up-selling, 
semantic linking, adaptation for mobile, adaptation for accessibility and so 
on. Whether it's on .com or .semantic shouldn't make any difference.

There's a lot of work going into developing trust models in SW, my own 
contribution and application can be visualised at [1] but there are many 

To sum up, trust in the metadata is the issue, not the TLD.



[1] http://www.icra.org/projects/quatro/toolsdemo/

Phil Archer
Chief Technical Officer, ICRA

Working for a Safer Internet

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dr. Francis MUGUET" <muguet@ensta.fr>
To: "Danny Ayers" <danny.ayers@gmail.com>
Cc: "semantic-web at W3C" <semantic-web@w3c.org>
Sent: Friday, October 07, 2005 1:21 PM
Subject: Re: Semantic Web gTLDs

Hello Danny
> How do respond to suggestions that new TLDs are harmful to the Web, e.g.

My proposal is to not create  "traditionnal" new gTLDs, but to create
new gTLDs that empowers new technologies, make them implementable.

So far, the progress of the semantic web (SW) has been very slow, and
often derided as the "pedantic web".
One may ask questions why the SW progress has been so slow.
If there is any studies on this, please let me know.

Use of metadata has been reduced in comparison to the early days of
the Web. Except for specialized ones, search engines are not relying on
Metadata anymore, because metadata have been spoilt by pornographers
and "referencing" companies that are using any conceivable trick
to cheat the referencing algorithm of search engines that must
constantly evolve to fight those tricks. There is a secret war
going out there.

One goal of a SWgTLD is a get clean, unspoilt, METADATA.
Sites that are purposedly spoiling their metadata, are removed
from the SWgTLD registry.

Since the goal of SWgTLD domain is to bring a real added value
to the Web, and not to fill the pockets of private companies
acting as registrars, we do not care if there is not a rush
to  SWgTLDs domains in the beginning.
Anyway, it cannot be slower that the actual progress of
the SW in the current chaotic and corrupted cyberspace.

> New Top Level Domains Considered Harmful - Tim Berners-Lee
> http://www.w3.org/DesignIssues/TLD
> Why Using TLDs for Filtering is Ineffective, Harmful, and Unnecessary
> - Ian Jacobs
> http://www.w3.org/2004/03/28-tld
I do concur with what has been written in those two documents.
I am going to add in the semantic.cc site a topic
related to new gTLDs and put those links there.
None of the criticisms voiced against "traditionnal" new gTLDs
apply considerning the SWgTLDs.
It is not about filtering but about empowering.

ICANN is making a lot money by subcontracting to commercial
registrars ( at the TLDs level, and then for domain names )
but this has adverse effects.

At the governance level, it is interesting to note that the W3C felt it
has to take a position.  It is quite logical, since ICANN was
implicitely dealing with content-related issues, not just
plain addressing issues.

Many people, including governments, are believing that the current
introduction of new gTLDs is a way for ICANN to get more money,
as all brand names are being forced ( to protect their trademark )
to buy names in those new extensions.

This aspect is not present is our proposal, as each SWgTLDs is planned
to be managed by a multi-stakeholder partnership where civil society
is going to be included.

Another aspect, is that despite the name, the SWgTLDs are not only
about SW but also about DOIs and P2P.
It is time that some truely non-profit project be offered as
an alternative to the current DOI ( which is not using the
DNS system of ICANN by the way, but a completely different
Handle system ). I propose that this new alternative DOI be
P2P ( BitTorrent ) friendly.
Therefore in terms of technical innovations, we are a long way
from ".xxx".

How does the SW community interact with DOI and P2P, I would
be curious to know, as those two paradigms are spreading
at a much faster pace than SW.

Best regards


> Cheers,
> Danny.
> On 10/6/05, Dr. Francis MUGUET <muguet@ensta.fr> wrote:
>>I an new on this list, and I would not
>>dare to qualify as a person with a decent
>>knowledge of RDF/OWL,
>>however, since the political circumstances
>>seem propitious at WSIS ( World Summit on the Information
>>Society  http://www.wsis.org ) , I naively felt it
>>could be the moment to submit a bold proposal :
>>Semantic Web gTLDs.
>>I am in a position to
>>propose this idea to delegations
>>at the UN in Geneva, however I want to be
>>re-assured that this proposal makes sense.
>>see the site ( under construction )
>>There are several specific proposed SWgTLDs  that
>>are going to be detailed later ( unless I get convinced
>>that my proposal is unfeasible )
>>The two ome about which some thinking is under way by friends are
>>..ART  for digital artists
>>..EQUI  transforming the whole gTLDs into a worldwide marketplace;
>>There are two perspective in this proposal :
>>1/ a proposal in itself, with interlinked technical and governance
>>aspects, hopefully to be implemented preferably sooner
>>than later.
>>2/ an illustration that the report of the WGIG
>>( http://www.wgig.org ) stays only at the bottom of
>>the OSI layers, it dealt in part with Internet but
>>did not deal with the Web !!!!
>>  Questions about HTML, XML, SW, DOIs etc... were
>>  completely left aside.. it is rather stunning.
>>Your comments and suggestions are kindly requested.
>>Since doubt is the beginning of wisdom,
>>you can be brutally honest in your opinion.
>>If you wish to participate to this adventurous enterprise,
>>feel free to subscribe to the mailing as indicated
>>on the site.
>>Best regards
>>Pôle de Développement pour l'Information Scientifique
>>"Réseaux de la Connaissance et Société de l'Information"
>>Scientific Information Development Laboratory
>>"Knowledge Networks & Information Society" (KNIS)
>>32 Blvd Victor 75739 PARIS cedex FRANCE
>>Phone: (33)1 45 52 60 19  Fax: (33)1 45 52 52 82
>>muguet@ensta.fr   http://www.ensta.fr/~muguet
>>mirror            http://www.muguet.org
>>MDPI Foundation Open Access Journals
>>Associate Publisher
>>http://www.mdpi.org   http://www.mdpi.net
>>muguet@mdpi.org       muguet@mdpi.net
>>World Summit On the Information Society (WSIS)
>>Civil Society Working Groups
>>Scientific Information :  http://www.wsis-si.org  chair
>>Patents & Copyrights   :  http://www.wsis-pct.org co-chair
>>Financing Mechanismns  :  http://www.wsis-finance.org web
>>UNMSP project : http://www.unmsp.org
>>WTIS initiative: http://www.wtis.org
> --
> http://dannyayers.com



Pôle de Développement pour l'Information Scientifique
"Réseaux de la Connaissance et Société de l'Information"
Scientific Information Development Laboratory
"Knowledge Networks & Information Society" (KNIS)

32 Blvd Victor 75739 PARIS cedex FRANCE
Phone: (33)1 45 52 60 19  Fax: (33)1 45 52 52 82
muguet@ensta.fr   http://www.ensta.fr/~muguet
mirror            http://www.muguet.org

MDPI Foundation Open Access Journals
Associate Publisher
http://www.mdpi.org   http://www.mdpi.net
muguet@mdpi.org       muguet@mdpi.net

World Summit On the Information Society (WSIS)
Civil Society Working Groups
Scientific Information :  http://www.wsis-si.org  chair
Patents & Copyrights   :  http://www.wsis-pct.org co-chair
Financing Mechanismns  :  http://www.wsis-finance.org web

UNMSP project : http://www.unmsp.org
WTIS initiative: http://www.wtis.org
Received on Friday, 7 October 2005 12:56:52 UTC

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