Web Payments Telecon Minutes for 2014-02-26

Thanks to Dave Longley and David I. Lehn for scribing this week! The minutes
for this week's Web Payments telecon are now available:

https://web-payments.org/minutes/2014-02-26/

Full text of the discussion follows for W3C archival purposes.
Audio from the meeting is available as well (link provided below).

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Web Payments Community Group Telecon Minutes for 2014-02-26

Agenda:
  http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webpayments/2014Feb/0130.html
Topics:
  1. WebMob Payments Task Force
  2. Web Commerce API Vote
  3. Persona and Web Identity Spec
Chair:
  Manu Sporny
Scribe:
  Dave Longley and David I. Lehn
Present:
  Dave Longley, Manu Sporny, Brent Shambaugh, David I. Lehn, Evan 
  Schwartz
Audio:
  https://web-payments.org/minutes/2014-02-26/audio.ogg

Dave Longley is scribing.
Manu Sporny:  Any updates or changes to the agenda today? Hearing 
  none, moving on.

Topic: WebMob Payments Task Force

Brent Shambaugh: https://github.com/w3c-webmob/payments-use-cases
Manu Sporny:  Natasha is at the Mobile World Congress, so can't 
  be here
Manu Sporny:  Can you run us through the payments use cases, 
  Brent?
Brent Shambaugh:  Paper is trying to deliver a feel for what's 
  out there,  talks about current solutions
Brent Shambaugh:  I started learning how to edit this thing so i 
  have my own fork of it here: 
  https://github.com/bshambaugh/payments-use-cases
Brent Shambaugh:  I'm going to go through and following the 
  template that Natasha created. I have added many payment 
  providers - Square, Dwolla, etc.
Manu Sporny:  I think mainly what Natasha is looking for is 
  mobile-specific use cases, that's not to say it's not important 
  to do a survey of all of them, it's important for the web 
  payments group.
Manu Sporny:  It might be good to see how each one of these 
  payment mechanisms works for mobile specifically
Manu Sporny:  For example, how exactly is Square used on mobile? 
  That's a mobile use case. I don't know if Western Union has any 
  mobile use cases.
Manu Sporny:  Square has the little card reader attachment that 
  plugs into the audio jack and you accept credit cards by swiping 
  through that, that's definnitely a mobile use case.
Manu Sporny:  Amazon payments may not be super mobile heavy, for 
  example, use case may be different, maybe amazon payments 
  analysis goes in a separate web payments document
Manu Sporny:  What do you think of that approach?
Brent Shambaugh:  Ok.
Manu Sporny:  I think Natasha is looking for mobile-specific 
  stuff ... you could argue anything could work on mobile, but 
  she's looking for example for things like NFC, bluetooth low 
  energy, and how those fit into the payment landscape.
Manu Sporny:  For example if you're in a museum and you want to 
  buy a ticket you could use bluetooth low energy, there are some 
  proprietary mobile wallet solutions out there, we should include 
  those.
Manu Sporny: We already have the Web Payments use cases here, 
  which is where we've been gathering over the past several years: 
  https://web-payments.org/specs/source/use-cases/
Manu Sporny:  The other thing that we might want to do is to take 
  a look at the use cases for some of the newer initiatives, like 
  Bitcoin, Ripple, etc.
Manu Sporny:  I don't know if you've seen this document before, 
  Brent?
Manu Sporny:  Whatever you find out and create if it doesn't fit 
  in the mobile use cases document it should go in the Web Payments 
  use cases document
Manu Sporny:  I don't know if i'd categorize the "use cases" on 
  Natasha's document for google wallet/paypal as use cases, they 
  are more like product features, which can still be a fine way to 
  go about it, but using use cases lets you genericize it and see 
  the commonality of it.
Manu Sporny:  Both google and paypal let you pay via a wallet 
  system, that's a shared use case
Manu Sporny:  They both have the ability to use a credit 
  card/debit card, that's a shared use case
Manu Sporny:  The ones that are different are ... the paypal case 
  doesn't let you include card loyalty schemes whereas google does
Manu Sporny:  At some point the work has to be done to go through 
  all payment mechanisms out there to list what they can and can't 
  do, so it has to be done anyway, the concern is that i'm not sure 
  if you'll be able to do all of that background to do it before 
  the end of march, i don't know if you have that kind of time
Brent Shambaugh:  I don't know what i have planned this month 
  really, my assumption is that this will be a week by week thing
Manu Sporny:  Yeah it is, by the end of the third week there 
  should be something pretty solid that Natasha can work with.
Manu Sporny:  Maybe this is as simple as going to a website and 
  dumping a features list in there?
Manu Sporny:  After we have that we can try and organize that
Manu Sporny:  It would help if you linked each one of those to a 
  website
Manu Sporny:  Then we could say we've got all the popular payment 
  companies on the web and then we can divvy up the work
Manu Sporny:  It might be better to just put this all in a wiki
Manu Sporny:  It's going to be hard to do PRs for each use case, 
  too much overhead, let's hack on it in a wiki quickly and then 
  put the end result in the document Natasha put together.
Brent Shambaugh:  Using a wiki for cooperation might be good
Manu sets up a wiki page for working on Payments and Mobile use 
  cases.
Manu Sporny: Here's the mobile use cases wiki page: 
  https://www.w3.org/community/webpayments/wiki/WebPaymentsMobileUseCases
Manu Sporny:  You can create a table to check off each feature 
  for each payment provider, etc.
Manu Sporny:  I'll fill out a few examples like PaySwarm and 
  Stripe.

Topic: Web Commerce API Vote

Manu Sporny: 
  http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webpayments/2014Feb/0119.html
Manu Sporny:  We've got a good number of votes coming in, every 
  one is positive except for one.
Manu Sporny:  I followed up with the person casting a negative 
  vote ... there was a miscommunication with what the purpose of 
  the spec is.
Manu Sporny:  The person thought that the only way to initiate 
  payment was through the browser, but all the spec is trying to do 
  is standardize payment request and repsonse
Manu Sporny:  Standardizing what the JSON looks like
Manu Sporny:  The API in the document provides an example for how 
  it could be implemented in a browser, but the core of the 
  protocol should be able to be initiated by just doing HTTP and 
  the person that did the negative vote didn't think that was the 
  case.
Manu Sporny:  You can do this without the need for something in 
  the browser itself
Manu Sporny:  So it was a vote against the browser API (end to 
  end) and it wasn't against standardizing the request and response 
  format, the person that voted negatively would be fine with 
  standardizing those
Manu Sporny:  There's a week left in the vote, I'll ping people 
  individually if they haven't already voted. I also failed to 
  specify fields for first and last name for the first 4 people 
  that voted, so they'll have to identify themselves for their 
  votes to stick. That was an unfortunate oversight on my part, I 
  think I know who 2 out of the 4 people are.
Dave Longley:  Need to drop off. [scribe assist by David I. Lehn]
David I. Lehn is scribing.
Manu Sporny:  We needed Dave Longley to discuss the HTTP 
  Signatures stuff. Maybe we should make this call short?
Evan Schwartz:  I'd like to hear a bit more about the Persona / 
  Web Identity spec stuff.

Topic: Persona and Web Identity Spec

Manu Sporny:  Mozilla been working on web identity system called 
  Persona.
Manu Sporny:  Simple spec that just authenticated that you own a 
  particular email address.
Manu Sporny:  You go to site and get digitally signed assertion 
  from email provider so you can sign in.
Manu Sporny:  Mozilla Persona decoupled the assertion of who you 
  are from site you log into, very privacy conscious.
Manu Sporny:  Made a polyfill for navigator api, that was the 
  other neat thing they did.
Manu Sporny:  They could support hundreds of millions of people 
  logging in through persona.
Manu Sporny:  The solution was partially centralized at first. 
  Then they suddenly published an "After Action Review", which you 
  typically do at the end of a project.
Manu Sporny: https://wiki.mozilla.org/Identity/Persona_AAR
Manu Sporny:  Two weeks ago posted after action review, then they 
  went silent.  It has become apparent that the entire persona team 
  has now been assigned to other projects.
Manu Sporny:  Not tombstoned but put into maintenance mode.  Only 
  work will be volunteer based development, Persona will be kept 
  alive for the foreseeable future.
Manu Sporny:  They are going to focus on Firefox accounts, more 
  vertical integration w/ FirefoxOS.
Manu Sporny:  They sent out email last week detailing what's 
  going on:
Manu Sporny: 
  https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/mozilla.dev.identity/Qnxt8lmOEeo/fVtJrMDfOjMJ
Manu Sporny:  They will try to get a blog post about the status 
  out some time this week.
Manu Sporny:  If we want more features we'll have to go in and 
  implement them ourselves.
Manu Sporny: https://web-payments.org/specs/source/web-identity/
Manu Sporny:  We've got a web identity spec that is supposed to 
  integrate with Persona.
Manu Sporny:  We're getting some interest from other large 
  organizations in the Web Identity spec and other people are 
  working on their own solutions.
Manu Sporny:  Persona going into maintenance mode is a step 
  backwards for the Web. We wanted someone else to develop that 
  solution, but it doesn't look like it's going to happen.
Manu Sporny:  The other spec out there is OpenID Connect.
Manu Sporny:  Should the web identity spec be compatilble with 
  OpenID Connect?  It probably should be, we don't want to pick a 
  winner, but we may have to provide an alternative to OpenID 
  Connect.
Manu Sporny:  There are other approaches out there as well, such 
  as Namecoin.
Manu Sporny:  That is a fully decentralized solution.
Manu Sporny:  Not clear where we should go at this point.
Manu Sporny:  The web payments workshop is coming up.  Should 
  expect identity will be a big topic there. You need solid 
  identity for payments.
Manu Sporny:  Should have alternatives to show for identity and 
  KYC before the workshop.
Manu Sporny:  Any comments before we end the call?
Manu Sporny:  Brent, we'll work on the use cases in the interim. 
  I'll get the first two examples filled out and then it'd help if 
  you get the rest.
Manu Sporny:  We'll chat again next week. Bye!

Received on Wednesday, 26 February 2014 17:50:20 UTC