- From: Wilco Fiers <wilco.fiers@deque.com>
- Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2017 18:59:09 +0200
- To: Accessibility Conformance Testing <public-wcag-act@w3.org>
- Message-ID: <CAHVyjGMw=76vspRvEQb1kHyHrTgytWQix5_+hBVdNaRFHxs3wQ@mail.gmail.com>
Hi ACT Taskforce, Here's a discussion that might interest you. Personally I think changing SC numbers between WCAG 2.0 and 2.1 is quite a bad idea for the comprehensiveness of tools. I imagine I'm not the only one, so if you do have an opinion I encourage you to weigh in. Wilco ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Michael Gower <michael.gower@ca.ibm.com> Date: Tue, Sep 19, 2017 at 3:44 PM Subject: Re: Compromise on Numbering: Changing 11 AAA numbers solves the level problem To: David MacDonald <david@can-adapt.com> Cc: Alastair Campbell <acampbell@nomensa.com>, WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org> Great approach, David. It appears to address the primary concerns I've read, while keeping us from the situation of shoving level As and AAs after AAAs in the order. It's better than any of the options laid out in the Numbering doc cited by JF, IMO. Michael Gower IBM Accessibility Research 1803 Douglas Street, Victoria, BC <https://maps.google.com/?q=1803+Douglas+Street,+Victoria,+BC+%C2%A0V8T+5C3&entry=gmail&source=g> V8T 5C3 <https://maps.google.com/?q=1803+Douglas+Street,+Victoria,+BC+%C2%A0V8T+5C3&entry=gmail&source=g> gowerm@ca.ibm.com voice: (250) 220-1146 * cel: (250) 661-0098 * fax: (250) 220-8034 From: David MacDonald <david@can-adapt.com> To: WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>, Alastair Campbell < acampbell@nomensa.com> Date: 2017-09-18 06:09 PM Subject: Re: Compromise on Numbering: Changing 11 AAA numbers solves the level problem ------------------------------ > ... your proposal appears to presume that entities will either be fully WCAG 2.0 compliant, or fully WCAG 2.1 compliant, and yet doesn't leave room for entities going for mandated compliance to 2.0 + cherry picking *some* new SC now, and gradually adding additional new SC over time. In a case like that (which I personally anticipate will be the norm, certainly in the early days), how do we address numbering conflicts in your proposal? The Level A and AA numbers don't change. That is what Orgs and countries are meeting. Only 8 out of 25 AAA change. Any orgs choosing AAA SCs are already cherry picking, so I don't see a disruption there. Cheers, David MacDonald *Can**Adapt**Solutions Inc.* Mobile: 613.806.9005 <(613)%20806-9005> *LinkedIn * <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.linkedin.com_in_davidmacdonald100&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=Y4tjcIM8bZh0Iet0WYf1Hn5xumTjh7T3STLAY_Tqg8U&e=> *twitter.com/davidmacd* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__twitter.com_davidmacd&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=082wMEOx4CCjEL452-58C0ULEOj4FzD79FjlkFsZu2o&e=> *GitHub* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__github.com_DavidMacDonald&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=yyYknsXiQPakbVpNDhRcl5YlSxDU_aZfw7LbdhDNY4E&e=> *www.Can-Adapt.com* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.can-2Dadapt.com_&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=ev5yn2uZLEK4yLSLtjFiT1ykt0RD-pfwzp0LFuP2U1c&e=> * Adapting the web to all** users* * Including those with disabilities* If you are not the intended recipient, please review our *privacy policy* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.davidmacd.com_disclaimer.html&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=NNBed-e2isA_oDbFcodi1PpESkH6_DepSn7_53F6Q20&e=> On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 9:05 PM, David MacDonald <*david@can-adapt.com* <david@can-adapt.com>> wrote: I've got it down to 8 out of 25 AAA SCs numbers changing. *tinyurl.com/jmo9st4* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__tinyurl.com_jmo9st4&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=DYXTexwUWXzKPiepX4FkFIQ5bVIcLjhPG197Z8etQgk&e=> Cheers, David MacDonald *Can**Adapt**Solutions Inc.* Mobile: *613.806.9005* <(613)%20806-9005> *LinkedIn * <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.linkedin.com_in_davidmacdonald100&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=Y4tjcIM8bZh0Iet0WYf1Hn5xumTjh7T3STLAY_Tqg8U&e=> *twitter.com/davidmacd* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__twitter.com_davidmacd&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=082wMEOx4CCjEL452-58C0ULEOj4FzD79FjlkFsZu2o&e=> *GitHub* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__github.com_DavidMacDonald&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=yyYknsXiQPakbVpNDhRcl5YlSxDU_aZfw7LbdhDNY4E&e=> *www.Can-Adapt.com* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.can-2Dadapt.com_&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=ev5yn2uZLEK4yLSLtjFiT1ykt0RD-pfwzp0LFuP2U1c&e=> * Adapting the web to all** users* * Including those with disabilities* If you are not the intended recipient, please review our *privacy policy* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.davidmacd.com_disclaimer.html&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=NNBed-e2isA_oDbFcodi1PpESkH6_DepSn7_53F6Q20&e=> On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 7:23 PM, David MacDonald <*david@can-adapt.com* <david@can-adapt.com>> wrote: Here's what it would look like *tinyurl.com/jmo9st4* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__tinyurl.com_jmo9st4&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=DYXTexwUWXzKPiepX4FkFIQ5bVIcLjhPG197Z8etQgk&e=> It's a new proposal not included in any previous proposed numbering model. The remaining options are to have: - the levels all mixed up - have the numbers all mixed up in the new WCAG 2.0 - deemphasize numbers I would like to see the document look elegant, new, and integrated. I think it's a worthwhile compromise to allow AAA to change numbers. Cheers, David MacDonald *Can**Adapt**Solutions Inc.* Mobile: *613.806.9005* <(613)%20806-9005> *LinkedIn * <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.linkedin.com_in_davidmacdonald100&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=Y4tjcIM8bZh0Iet0WYf1Hn5xumTjh7T3STLAY_Tqg8U&e=> *twitter.com/davidmacd* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__twitter.com_davidmacd&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=082wMEOx4CCjEL452-58C0ULEOj4FzD79FjlkFsZu2o&e=> *GitHub* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__github.com_DavidMacDonald&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=yyYknsXiQPakbVpNDhRcl5YlSxDU_aZfw7LbdhDNY4E&e=> *www.Can-Adapt.com* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.can-2Dadapt.com_&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=ev5yn2uZLEK4yLSLtjFiT1ykt0RD-pfwzp0LFuP2U1c&e=> * Adapting the web to all** users* * Including those with disabilities* If you are not the intended recipient, please review our *privacy policy* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.davidmacd.com_disclaimer.html&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=NNBed-e2isA_oDbFcodi1PpESkH6_DepSn7_53F6Q20&e=> On Mon, Sep 18, 2017 at 4:57 PM, David MacDonald <*david@can-adapt.com* <david@can-adapt.com>> wrote: The current problem is that new Level SCs come in after AAA in thenstandard unless we jugle the order or deemphise number, neither of which is ideal. Here's a proposal that might work as a compromise. Level AAA SCs are less entrenched in the WCAG culture. What if we agree that those numbers can change. - Change 11 Level AAA SC numbers - Insert the new SCs in their proper place - move accidental activation to Pointer Guideling as per Steve's suggestion Issue #376 - Make new Speech guideline 2.7 This would allow the numbers to make sense with the levels also in order, so no Level A or AA would follow AAA, and would keep ALL Level A and AA SC numbers in tact. Cheers, David MacDonald *Can**Adapt**Solutions Inc.* Mobile: *613.806.9005* <(613)%20806-9005> *LinkedIn * <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.linkedin.com_in_davidmacdonald100&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=Y4tjcIM8bZh0Iet0WYf1Hn5xumTjh7T3STLAY_Tqg8U&e=> *twitter.com/davidmacd* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__twitter.com_davidmacd&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=082wMEOx4CCjEL452-58C0ULEOj4FzD79FjlkFsZu2o&e=> *GitHub* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__github.com_DavidMacDonald&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=yyYknsXiQPakbVpNDhRcl5YlSxDU_aZfw7LbdhDNY4E&e=> *www.Can-Adapt.com* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.can-2Dadapt.com_&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=ev5yn2uZLEK4yLSLtjFiT1ykt0RD-pfwzp0LFuP2U1c&e=> * Adapting the web to all** users* * Including those with disabilities* If you are not the intended recipient, please review our *privacy policy* <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.davidmacd.com_disclaimer.html&d=DwMFaQ&c=jf_iaSHvJObTbx-siA1ZOg&r=_9rqR3xSCWQUlv9VpOcJwkP7H0XWQXmxeMmqQl6Fikc&m=PWEyJ6cM4URrbKVGegb1SDhluP206bTOckyDJS0Sqh4&s=NNBed-e2isA_oDbFcodi1PpESkH6_DepSn7_53F6Q20&e=> -- *Wilco Fiers* Senior Accessibility Engineer - Co-facilitator WCAG-ACT - Chair Auto-WCAG
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Received on Tuesday, 19 September 2017 16:59:34 UTC