- From: Jason Johnson (BING) <jasjoh@microsoft.com>
- Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 20:04:28 +0000
- To: "public-vocabs@w3.org" <public-vocabs@w3.org>
> -----Original Message----- > From: Laura Dawson [mailto:Laura.Dawson@bowker.com] > Sent: Thursday, February 6, 2014 3:39 PM > To: Gregg Kellogg; Jason Johnson (BING) > Cc: public-vocabs@w3.org > Subject: Re: Schema.org Sports Vocabulary Proposal > > In the book world, FWIW, we have the concept of ³contributors² who indeed > can assume multiple ³roles". Expressed in RDBMS, it amounted to appending > a new row to a table where the personıs name is repeated, and their > additional role. (And so on, if the person has more than two roles.) So for the > book Green Eggs and Ham, Dr. Seuss is listed twice - once as the author and > once as the illustrator. Different websites consume/use/display this data in > different ways, but I bet on more than one occasion you have seen > someoneıs name listed twice on a book listing page, because theyıve had > more than one role in creating that book and that website is importing the > data without refining it. > > Expressed semantically, I am not sure quite how you would go about it > because I am not fluent (yet). But the concept of relating one person to > many roles is one that media industries (music, video, games, books) have > grappled with for quite some time. > > At ISNI, we have an ever-growing list of roles a contributor can play - and a > contributor is very loosely defined; s/he can be anyone who adds value to > content on the web. So the football/soccer (Iım neutral) player Cristiano > Ronaldo, though he has not created any content himself, has had a great deal > of content created about him, so his ISNI URI is > http://isni.org/isni/0000000114607485. (Youıll see at the bottom a link to his > Wikipedia page - it is a reciprocal link.) > > More relevant to your baseball example, Derek Jeter obviously has one ISNI > and multiple roles - batter and shortstop - with statistics linked to each role. > > Donıt know if that is helpful, but I sympathize with the problem. > This indeed looks to be the 'Roles' problem we faced in this proposal - the question is what the best solution is for schema.org. :) > > > On 2/6/14, 5:59 PM, "Gregg Kellogg" <gregg@greggkellogg.net> wrote: > > >On Feb 6, 2014, at 11:56 AM, Jason Johnson (BING) > ><jasjoh@microsoft.com> > >wrote: > > > >> The Schema.org partners, in collaboration with experts from the BBC > >>and IPTC/SportsML, are pleased to share a proposal for improving the > >>Schema.org sports vocabulary. The proposal includes support for > >>describing sports organizations, athletes, and events, with a focus on > >>the most common sports types being published on the Web today. > >>Although the proposal includes support for describing sports > >>statistics within these domains, the initial set of properties are > >>limited to those which are broadly applicable. More detailed, > >>sport-specific statistics will be the subject of future additions to the base > statistic classes. > >> > >> The Schema.org sports vocabulary proposal is available as an exported > >>PDF in the W3C Web Schemas - Sports wiki and a machine readable > >>version of the schema will be posted soon. We encourage the web > >>community to review and provide feedback via the wiki, this mailing > >>list, or by joining the Schema.org sports vocabulary discussion group. > >> > >> See Also: > >>http://blog.schema.org/2014/02/schemaorg-sports-vocabulary.html > > > >I'm really happy to see progress in this area, as I've been working on > >something similar myself. > > > >Getting into some specifics: > > > >OrderedEvent seems like it's instituting a patter that could also be > >useful in other contexts. Perhaps something which leverages > >schema:ItemList, such as an OrderedItemList; this could use techniques > >from the Ordered List Ontology [1]. One advantage of such a vocabulary > >is to not require traversing the list through first/previous links, as > >they can be directly indexed. This is also much friendlier for doing > >SPARQL queries. However, this would add a layer of indirection. Did the > >group consider this type of model? Alternatively, makeing something > >like a schema:eventList property, which specifically takes a sub-class > >of rdf:List that restricts the range of rdf:first to be a schema:Event > >would work well with existing list representations (e.g., JSON-LD and > >RDFa), without requiring more "semantic overhead". > > > >Regarding sub-types of SportsTeam, this may be an example where some > >enumeration is more valuable. In my modeling, I defined a > >"sportsDiscipline" property with the range of SportsDiscipline. This > >can then allow any number of disciplines to be defined as instances and > >relate them, e.g., to DBpedia/Freebase URIs. For example > > > >:sfgiants a schema:SportsTeam > > schema:name "San Francisco Giants"; > > schema:sportsDiscipline :MajorLeagueBaseball . > > > >:MajorLeagueBaseball a schema:SportsDiscipline > > schema:sameAs <http://db.org/resource/Major_League_Baseball>, > ><http://www.freebase.com/m/09p14> . > > > >Otherwise, trying to enumerate every possible type of sport as a > >distinct sub-class becomes futile. A sportsDiscipline can also be > >useful in describing player skills. > > > >The teamSpecificRoles also seem a bit narrow, and people may play > >multiple roles. Roles might better be modeled with something like a > >"Contribution" class; we discussed this for the TV and Radio updates, > >although nothing much came about from it. A person may contribute to a > >sports team using multiple roles. This also allows modeling finer > >grained sports activities such as a season, series, game, period, or > >individual play. The roles can then be defined using an enumeration > >class similarly to sports disciplines. Per-sport role properties are > >simpler, but also suffer from the cost of adding them specifically to > >the vocabulary rather than allowing the use of external enumerations. > > > >More team hierarchies: Defining something like SportsAssociation, > >League, and Division allows many team sports to be contained within an > >organizational hierarchy consistent with many amateur and professional > >sports, and allows more interesting information to be described for > >those various organizations. > > > >Other things to model in sports. > > > >The concept of a sports team really is something that refers to some > >instance of the organization. For example, the 1957 Giants and 2013 > >Giants are really two different teams. We defined a "Season" class for > >this, so that a SportsTeam has many seasons, and players are associated > >with given seasons. A Season is modeled as a sub-class of SportsEvent, > >as it has a beginning and end, but there may be some other kind of > >event which is more appropriate. Similarly, a Season can have series > >which have games, or may simply have games. A game is divided into > >periods and plays. Below this level, a PlayAction becomes more useful > >than an event, to describe some particular play (such as at-bat, down, > >or individual event). > > > >I'd certainly like to know if you considered modeling at such detail, > >and how this meshes with your own thoughts. > > > >> Cheers, > >> > >> Jason Johnson > >> Microsoft > > > >[1] http://smiy.sourceforge.net/olo/spec/orderedlistontology.html
Received on Wednesday, 12 February 2014 20:04:57 UTC