{minutes} TTWG Meeting 2015-08-20

Thanks all for attending today's meeting. Minutes can be found in HTML format at http://www.w3.org/2015/08/20-tt-minutes.html


In text format:


   [1]W3C

      [1] http://www.w3.org/


                Timed Text Working Group Teleconference

20 Aug 2015

   See also: [2]IRC log

      [2] http://www.w3.org/2015/08/20-tt-irc

Attendees

   Present
          Thierry, nigel, atai, mike, courtney

   Regrets
          pal, frans

   Chair
          nigel

   Scribe
          nigel

Contents

     * [3]Topics
         1. [4]This meeting
         2. [5]Action Items
         3. [6]ATSC Liaison
         4. [7]HTMLCue Proposal
         5. [8]Unicode CLDR proposal
         6. [9]Issues
         7. [10]TTML2 Editorial Actions
         8. [11]TPAC 2015
         9. [12]AOB
     * [13]Summary of Action Items
     __________________________________________________________

   <trackbot> Date: 20 August 2015

   <scribe> scribe: nigel

This meeting

   nigel: We are adding ATSC liaison to the agenda as requested.
   ... Any other business?

   group: no other business

   nigel: Looking ahead, I'm going to have difficulty meeting on
   Thursday 10th. Will anyone else have problems?

   atai: Yes, I won't be able to join on that day.

   nigel: We can leave it scheduled but dependent on members
   wishing to attend and join, or cancel that one if need be.

Action Items

   action-414?

   <trackbot> action-414 -- Nigel Megitt to Add unicode liaison to
   weekly meeting agenda -- due 2015-08-20 -- PENDINGREVIEW

   <trackbot>
   [14]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/414


     [14] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/414


   close action-414

   <trackbot> Closed action-414.

ATSC Liaison

   [15]https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-tt/2015Aug/0002

   .html

     [15] https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-tt/2015Aug/0002.html


   nigel: We received this liaison from ATSC. Would anyone like to
   take us through it?

   mike: ATSC is heading down the path of using IMSC 1 for its
   next generation TV. A member
   ... has proposed support for extensions for colorGamut and 3D
   disparity.
   ... disparity is already in TTML2, but there's nothing I'm
   aware of on HDR or wide color gamut
   ... in this group. The proposal is to get us to think about it
   more than anything else.
   ... There are 2 specific proposals for pulling those features
   into IMSC 1.
   ... There was a lively discussion on the reflector about color
   gamut and what it might be useful
   ... for. I think that's down to, not so much that an author
   would want to use a wide color gamut,
   ... but that it would help implementations if the text
   signalled colors in a wide color gamut.
   ... That was more to get W3C TTWG thinking about the issue,
   which was successful based on
   ... the email exchange. The rest is to do with logistics of
   timing and in what form the requests
   ... might appear in the future.

   nigel: I had a conversation with Thierry and Pierre about the
   logistics side. Pierre and I
   ... concluded that the best thing for IMSC right now given the
   process state that its in is to
   ... keep it closed to new features, but to add them into the
   scope of TTML2 and IMSC 2.

   mike: Any thoughts on the schedule for all this work?

   nigel: It's clear that we're already behind relative to our
   intended timescale on TTML2. If we
   ... want to speed things up then we need more input from
   members other than Glenn. IMSC 2
   ... is planned for as soon as possible after TTML2. I wouldn't
   be surprised given the current
   ... state if that falls into 2016, it's hard to say exactly
   when.

   mike: With my TTWG hat on, I agree that not delaying IMSC 1 is
   the right answer, though it
   ... isn't necessarily what ATSC wants to hear. What's the
   timescale for publishing IMSC 1?

   nigel: That's entirely dependent on implementation work on IMSC
   1. We can't move on until
   ... we have met the exit criteria for the CR, which requires
   implementation work.

   mike: It sounds as though we need some feedback from pierre on
   that.

   nigel: Yes, he's got the best view right now.

   mike: We possibly need dave to come in on the colour mapping
   question.

   nigel: It's not clear to me that there's any specification work
   missing that we should take on.
   ... I have the impression that the colour spaces are all well
   defined and the semantic in TTML
   ... is also clear.

   mike: We may need some additional metadata to indicate where
   the sRGB 8 bits live in the
   ... 12 bit value space.

   nigel: I'd like to see a proposal for that on the email
   reflector - I'm a little sceptical right now.

   mike: Yes, I'll continue the email thread. I'm also happy to
   start preparing a liaison response for
   ... the liaison, to be sent back to ATSC.

   nigel: Pierre also volunteered to assist with that so between
   you two we should be able to get
   ... something together. The key points are that we won't
   include the features in IMSC 1 but
   ... will consider them for IMSC 2. For the color gamut question
   we need to have more discussion
   ... and conclude on the issue before we respond.

HTMLCue Proposal

   Courtney: I talked to the webkit team and they said they have
   no plans to add support for
   ... anything but WebVTT.

   atai: There's nothing more from me on this - we just need to
   think how to proceed.
   ... Nigel made a proposal to make it more concrete as to what
   we should propose. We need
   ... to decide if we need to include that.

   nigel: That's right. I had a think about this and a look at the
   dash.js work, and the simple
   ... approach is simply to replace the html content of a target
   div element. That would be my
   ... baseline proposal, since it appears to work.

   atai: I wonder if we could get stuck in detail if we discuss
   this.
   ... Getting a general feeling about if people are willing to
   implement this is more important.

   <mike> I need to get to another meeting. thanks for the time on
   the ATSC liaison. hear you next week.

   <tmichel> [16]http://www.w3.org/2001/11/StdLiaison#main


     [16] http://www.w3.org/2001/11/StdLiaison#main


   nigel: Looking back at last week's minutes, there were 3
   actions, Courtney's, mine and Thierry was going to check about
   WHATWG.

   tmichel: There's actually no liaison with WHATWG, so I
   contacted Michael Smith of the HTML WG
   ... to discuss how we might contact WHATWG. He suggested the
   best way might be to post
   ... to the public email address on this issue:

   <tmichel> whatwg@whatwg.org

   <tmichel> public mailing list for the WHATWG.

   tmichel: And he said that if we needed he could also help. He's
   not the formal liaison guy but
   ... he knows those guys and has been working with WHATWG for
   many years.

   atai: I can do that, but it would be on my own - it would be
   better from TTWG.

   tmichel: I agree it would be better to send it on behalf of
   TTWG to add leverage.

   nigel: Okay, I'm happy to do that then as chair.
   ... The draft text we have now is:
   [17]https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2015Aug/0009

   .html
   ... Just rereading that, imagining WHATWG receiving it, I guess
   it looks okay. I assume they
   ... know what TPAC is.

     [17] https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2015Aug/0009.html


   <tmichel> The people from who I would think you’d want to get
   most feedback on this

   <tmichel> particular proposal are Philip Jägenstedt
   (Opera/Blink), Silvia Pfeiffer,

   <tmichel> and Eric Carlson & Jer Noble (from Apple).

   <tmichel> >

   nigel: I'm happy to take an action to edit the draft and share
   with those people for initial
   ... input prior to posting to the public WHATWG list.

   <tmichel> IanHickson right would not be the most productive,
   especially since at the

   <tmichel> moment, he’s working on other things that don’t have
   much to to with the

   <tmichel> HTML spec.

   <scribe> ACTION: tmichel Send nigel email addresses of HTMLCue
   proposal reviewers [recorded in
   [18]http://www.w3.org/2015/08/20-tt-minutes.html#action01]

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-415 - Send nigel email addresses of
   htmlcue proposal reviewers [on Thierry Michel - due
   2015-08-27].

   <scribe> ACTION: nigel Edit proposal and send to HTMLCue
   proposal reviewers as listed by tmichel, following Action-415
   [recorded in
   [19]http://www.w3.org/2015/08/20-tt-minutes.html#action02]

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-416 - Edit proposal and send to
   htmlcue proposal reviewers as listed by tmichel, following
   action-415 [on Nigel Megitt - due 2015-08-27].

   nigel: If all the feedback is positive I'll go ahead and send
   to WHATWG, otherwise I'll bring it
   ... back to this group for further discussion.
   ... I'll CC interested folk too so you don't lose track of the
   discussion.

Unicode CLDR proposal

   nigel: I've not had any response from Mark Davis yet, so as per
   our discussion last week
   ... I will create an issue ticket with Unicode, containing the
   proposal.

   <scribe> ACTION: nigel Create ticket with Unicode for CLDR
   proposal, or add to existing one. [recorded in
   [20]http://www.w3.org/2015/08/20-tt-minutes.html#action03]

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-417 - Create ticket with unicode for
   cldr proposal, or add to existing one. [on Nigel Megitt - due
   2015-08-27].

Issues

   issue-402?

   <trackbot> issue-402 -- The permitted delimiters for two value
   attributes like cellResolution and frameRateMultiplier are
   undefined -- closed

   <trackbot>
   [21]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/402


     [21] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/402


   nigel: I raised this in error and it's already closed - thanks
   to Glenn for putting me right.

   issue-403?

   <trackbot> issue-403 -- The ordering of features in Appendix D
   differs from that in Appendix F -- raised

   <trackbot>
   [22]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/403


     [22] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/403


   reopen issue-403

   <trackbot> Re-opened issue-403.

TTML2 Editorial Actions

   nigel: There are now examples in the TTML2 ED for padding on
   span and for textAlign on span.

TPAC 2015

   nigel: Is there anything to add to the agenda, or does anyone
   need any assistance with TPAC,
   ... e.g. with registration etc?

   group: Nothing to add right now.

AOB

   nigel: We've covered other business as planned already.
   ... Just one note - referencing the earlier mention of dash.js,
   if anyone is interested in discussing
   ... implementation work in that area, EBU is hosting an open
   session at IBC, as per the email
   ... sent earlier in the week.
   ... Thanks very much everyone. [Adjourns meeting]

Summary of Action Items

   [NEW] ACTION: nigel Create ticket with Unicode for CLDR
   proposal, or add to existing one. [recorded in
   [23]http://www.w3.org/2015/08/20-tt-minutes.html#action03]
   [NEW] ACTION: nigel Edit proposal and send to HTMLCue proposal
   reviewers as listed by tmichel, following Action-415 [recorded
   in [24]http://www.w3.org/2015/08/20-tt-minutes.html#action02]
   [NEW] ACTION: tmichel Send nigel email addresses of HTMLCue
   proposal reviewers [recorded in
   [25]http://www.w3.org/2015/08/20-tt-minutes.html#action01]

   [End of minutes]
     __________________________________________________________


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Received on Thursday, 20 August 2015 15:10:35 UTC