RE: ACTION 124

John,

I don't see this definition as covering a "whole host of sites" but does appropriately capture what is fairly a "1st party" in a more expressive manner - aka objective measures.  The goal here was to develop a definition that provides understandable directions to industry for implementation.  I believe if we use terms like "knowingly" and "Intentionally" in isolation these will create significant confusion for publishers attempting to implement DNT as they are so subjective and can be interpreted 5 different ways by 5 different people.

- Shane

From: John Simpson [mailto:john@consumerwatchdog.org]
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2012 5:33 PM
To: Amy Colando
Cc: public-tracking@w3.org
Subject: Re: ACTION 124

It seems to me that your definition defines a whole host of sites as 1st party sites that a user would never understand to be acting as 1st parties. That's problematic if 1st party sites have few obligations under DNT.


On Feb 21, 2012, at 5:28 PM, Amy Colando (LCA) wrote:


Because that depends on detecting the state of mind of both of the site and the user ...  Trying to get to a more objective measurement...

From: John Simpson [mailto:john@consumerwatchdog.org]
Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2012 5:23 PM
To: Amy Colando (LCA)
Cc: public-tracking@w3.org<mailto:public-tracking@w3.org>
Subject: Re: ACTION 124

Amy,

Why is this better than:

A "first party" is any party, in a specific network interaction, that can infer with high probability that the user knowingly and intentionally communicated with it. Otherwise, a party is a third party.

Best,
John

On Feb 21, 2012, at 4:42 PM, Amy Colando (LCA) wrote:



Per the Action 124, here's a proposed First Party definition that I have worked on with Shane and Ted:

A First Party is the entity that owns the Web site or has Control over the Web site the consumer visits. A First Party also includes the owner of a widget, search box or similar service with which a consumer interacts, even if such First Party does not own or have Control over the Web site where the widget or services are displayed to the consumer.

A First Party includes Affiliates of that First Party, but only to the extent that the Affiliate  is (1) an entity that Controls, is Controlled by, or us under common Control with, the First Party; or (2) an entity where the relationship to the First Party is clear to consumers through co-branding or similar means.

A First Party must make reasonable efforts to disclose, in a manner easily discoverable by Users, its ownership or Control of a site or service, such as through branding on the site or service, disclosures in the privacy policy or terms of use linked to that site or service, or ....

Control of an entity means that one entity (1) is under significant common ownership or operational control of the other entity, or (2) has the power to exercise a controlling influence over the management or policies of the other entity.  In addition, for an entity to be under the Control of another entity and be treated as a First Party under this standard, the entity must also adhere to DNT standard in this specification.


Amy Colando
Senior Attorney, Online Services
Microsoft Corporation
Office: 425.703.6329
Mobile: 206.658.7704


----------
John M. Simpson
Consumer Advocate
Consumer Watchdog
1750 Ocean Park Blvd. ,Suite 200
Santa Monica, CA,90405
Tel: 310-392-7041
Cell: 310-292-1902
www.ConsumerWatchdog.org<http://www.ConsumerWatchdog.org>
john@consumerwatchdog.org<mailto:john@consumerwatchdog.org>


----------
John M. Simpson
Consumer Advocate
Consumer Watchdog
1750 Ocean Park Blvd. ,Suite 200
Santa Monica, CA,90405
Tel: 310-392-7041
Cell: 310-292-1902
www.ConsumerWatchdog.org<http://www.ConsumerWatchdog.org>
john@consumerwatchdog.org<mailto:john@consumerwatchdog.org>