[minutes] SVG IG Conf Call Dec 4th

Hi, Folks-

The minutes for the SVG IG Dec 4 teleconference can be found here:

 http://www.w3.org/2008/12/04-svgig-minutes.html

Or as plain text below:

   [1]W3C

      [1] http://www.w3.org/

                               - DRAFT -

                   SVG Interest Group Teleconference

04 Dec 2008

   See also: [2]IRC log

      [2] http://www.w3.org/2008/12/04-svgig-irc

Attendees

   Present
          Doug_Schepers, JeffSchiller, gwadej, Rob_Russell, Manuel,
          Dave_Porter

   Regrets
   Chair
          SV_MEETING_CHAIR

   Scribe
          Rob_Russell

Contents

     * [3]Topics
         1. [4]svgopen 2009
         2. [5]Mozilla, SVG WG
         3. [6]Community Website
     * [7]Summary of Action Items
     _________________________________________________________



   <JeffSchiller> give me a couple mins here

   <shepazu> sure

   <trackbot> Date: 04 December 2008

   howdy

   i'm the 1.149 number (caller id messed up on the voip)

   <HelderMagalhaes> (just to ease on the logs and general
   identification - also, I'll be following from IRC as usual :-) )

   <aneumann> I am also just on IRC, not on the phone. I'd like to
   discuss SVG Open in the first 10-15 minutes because I have to leave
   then

   <shepazu> scribeNick: Rob_Russell

svgopen 2009

   <aneumann> as you may have heard we did not find a local organizer
   for SVG Open 2009 in California

   <aneumann> our next lead is now Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania - David
   Dailey is looking into it

   <JeffSchiller> yes, i've seen some discussions about an alternate US
   location, PA

   <aneumann> a research company ([8]http://www.brainstage.com/) is
   interested in helping with the organization

      [8] http://www.brainstage.com/)

   doug: penn is okay, CA is better

   jeff: CA is more popular tech destination

   <aneumann> yes, but without a local organizer its too risky

   doug: mozilla has joined the SVG WG, hired Jonathan Watt for
   fulltime svg dev

   <aneumann> There is also Carnegie Mellon in Pittsburgh

   <HelderMagalhaes> Rob_Russell: great to know about that! :-)

   <aneumann> cool - good to hear abouth Jonathan

   doug: jwatt previously worked for joost, was a memeber of the svg wg
   and ig but joost has dropped svg
   ... asked jwatt to see if moz would be interested in helping
   organize

   <aneumann> I hope that we have a decision about Pittsburgh before
   Christmas and are able to put out information and Call for papers
   before end of the year

   doug: before going to a different location we should look into the
   moz option

   <aneumann> yes, the moz option would be fine also - but we'd need a
   decision soon - we can't wait much longer

   doug: jwatt may be able to get in on the IG calls within the next
   week or so (but he is busy)

   <aneumann> also Jwatt may be too busy with getting into Moz and not
   sure he can devote much time to SVG Open

   <aneumann> but he could help to get moz as a supporter/sponsor

   <shepazu> aneumann, do you think it would bad to wait until January?

   <shepazu> we could CfP before before the final location is announced

   <aneumann> yes, it would be good to have decided on a location
   before christmas

   doug: could say PA and CA are being considered

   <aneumann> hm - I don't know - we can already prepare the Cfp before
   and then put it immediately live when we have the decision

   <shepazu> I will respond more on the SVGOpen list

   doug: having moz sponsor the open would be a "feather in the cap",
   worth waiting a month (personal opinion) and CA would get more
   people

   jeff: agrees, CA is closer to tech stuff

   <aneumann> ok - I have to leave now anyway. Lets discuss it further
   on the SVG Open list

   doug: higher profile conf puts more pressure on MS than a smaller
   one

   <aneumann> I wouldn't mind if someone else would take the lead who
   is in better contact with moz than me

   doug: ultimately Andreas' decision
   ... will pursue Mozilla for a person to organize

   <shepazu> I will contact other Moz people than jwatt, too

   <aneumann> not only - I follow your advice

   <aneumann> ok - thanks and bye for now ...

   jeff: will jwatt be doing what tor was doing at moz?

   doug: yes, jonathan said mozilla is going for Full SVG 1.1
   compliance

   jeff: interesting to see if we can get a plugin from Moz (for ie?)
   that's fully supported

Mozilla, SVG WG

   doug: update from the SVG WG. Mozilla has joined. Most people aren't
   in on the politics and pain of getting the browser vendors to
   participate, this has been years in coming.
   ... Dedicating a Mozilla employee to SVG is huge. Robert O'Calahan
   has been proposing extensions to SVG for CSS, layout & positioning &
   ease of authoring.
   ... Don't think they'll simply do SVG 1.1 and that's all - more of a
   long term dedication to SVG as part of an open web platform.
   ... Despite some misgivings at the WG, we're going ahead with hixe's
   proposal to do inline SVG in html5 (plain text html). The WG would
   like feedback, especially use cases and tests.

   jeff: I followed some of the discussion, hixie proposal is the less
   rigid?

   doug: hixie's proposal allows for error correction. In html5 it's
   not considered an error (badly formed dom) but in XML SVG it would
   be.

   jeff: I don't mind going along with html5ish way as long as there's
   a way to export the SVG dom as XML

   doug: that's something this group could do, come up with test cases
   & use cases

   wade: do we have a pointer to this spec?

   doug: will ask hixie to make a version available
   ... you basically have to understand all of html5 to get it

   jeff: there's some contention but michael smith put out a spec for
   just the parsing

   doug: the edge cases might not show up there

   jeff: font element & text area clash with elements in html, worried
   about how that will work

   doug: WG is taking a hard line in that case, no whitelist or
   blacklist of elements or attributes for svg in html
   ... may lose things like entities

   jeff: not a big loss to me

   doug: illustrator uses entities heavily
   ... thinking of making an SVG Tidy that would replace entities and
   strip out unneeded namespaces

   jeff: sam ruby made a post that ranks highly about scrubbing svg -
   google SVG Tidy (written in ruby language)

   <scribe> ACTION: shepazu to publish version of HTML5 SVG syntax
   [recorded in
   [9]http://www.w3.org/2008/12/04-svgig-minutes.html#action01]

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-15 - Publish version of HTML5 SVG syntax
   [on Doug Schepers - due 2008-12-11].

   rob: it'd be nice to get this covered on This Week In HTML5 (mark
   pilgrim)

   doug: discussed SVG in HTML with the HTML WG at the tech plenary
   ... I think hixie's plan will win out over passing SVG to a strict
   parser
   ... this could have implications for standalone content as well
   ... it's possible that other browsers would have to understand this
   syntax which could be disruptive to existing SVG toolchains

Community Website

   jeff: last time we talked about generating content & rob would keep
   up on theming

   <JeffSchiller> rob: has put up a version of the theme on planetsvg

   <shepazu> [10]http://www.planetsvg.com/

     [10] http://www.planetsvg.com/

   <JeffSchiller> rob: go to planetsvg.com, log in, My Account > Edit,
   then choose the "Genesis_psc1"

   <JeffSchiller> rob: then click save, the site will change theme

   <JeffSchiller> rob: this theme is still a draft, lots of visual
   quirks

   <JeffSchiller> rob: so things are moving along, want people to take
   a look, but I'm aware there are problems

   <JeffSchiller> rob: might want to put the background in so it
   doesn't look so white-on-dark

   <JeffSchiller> jeff: are you looking for feedback yet?

   <JeffSchiller> rob: might make more sense for me to get it a little
   closer to 'done'

   <JeffSchiller> manuel: can i download the theme so i can work on it
   and submit it back?

   <JeffSchiller> jeff: can you email him a tgz?

   <JeffSchiller> rob: will do

   <JeffSchiller> doug: is there a feed for news items?

   <JeffSchiller> rob: i believe it's possible, but not sure why its'
   not available yet

   jeff: maybe we need a global feed, news tutorials, we should discuss
   what feeds we need exactly

   <HelderMagalhaes> JeffSchiller: Yes, having the possibility to
   syndicate to specific feed was rather useful

   <HelderMagalhaes> For example, a developer might

   <HelderMagalhaes> just want news, an artist might prefer the
   uploaded images feed

   <JeffSchiller> Helder: yes, i'll starta little page for this on the
   SVG IG wiki

   rob: we need to decide on blockers from "prime time"

   theme, feeds, primary navigation

   jeff: will start a wiki page on rss feeds
   ... we should discuss content on the site
   ... I did a tutorial, shiny buttons, I wasn't sure of the format of
   the content.I hosted images and svg on my site. How do we do this
   going forward?

   rob: there's g2 and there are image modules for drupal
   ... I think we should use a drupal image/gallery module

   jeff: if images were uploadable then it'd be easier to create
   content. Maybe authors who need js could ship their files to an
   admin who could post it

   rob: good idea

   jeff: rasters are easy, for svg & js standalone we'd want the author
   to send that to an admin
   ... we'd need to decide on paths

   rob: we could publish guidelines for that

   doug: I've hacked mediawiki to allow svg, I think it was using
   IFRAME but OBJECT might be better now
   ... Wondering if we could combine upload with another problem.
   Helping people on irc I use pastebin, it's generic but we need a
   dedicated svg pastebin.
   ... Ideally it would show the svg source and the image

   rob: sounds good, like a standalone site though

   doug: maybe a subdomain on planetsvg
   ... it'd be nice to be able to highlight code on a pastebin too

   <HelderMagalhaes> Yeah, having a raster feature for a paste bin
   would be great!

   rob: i think there could be xss issues with that

   <HelderMagalhaes> (even if limited to static SVG only, which would
   be the natural option for security reasons...)

   doug: that could be avoided by stripping out all js

   <HelderMagalhaes> maybe using a rasterizer? rsvg or Batik
   server-side

   <HelderMagalhaes> (that could also help new users to try SVG even
   without local support (in IE, of course)

   <HelderMagalhaes> )

   doug: it'd be nice if, at least, people could paste their svg in an
   edit box and use that as a way to add images to the gallery

   <stelt> HelderMagalhaes: i have a GUI for a rasterizer service
   somewhere

   <gwadej> I've got to run to a meeting.

   jeff: to make things easier for authors, maybe we could allow people
   to upload js & svg then an admin/mod approves it

   rob: yes, i think that's a great role for a specific type of
   moderator

   <HelderMagalhaes> stelt: Yes, I know about it, but the idea was
   allowing that online (server-side) or client side for click-and-see
   experience like in w3schools. For example,
   [11]http://www.w3schools.com/js/tryit.asp?filename=try_dom_form_subm
   it

     [11] http://www.w3schools.com/js/tryit.asp?filename=try_dom_form_submit

   <DavePorter> Sorry guys, I have to drop off! Thanks for the meeting
   and hearing about recent progress.

   jeff: might try to put out a part 2 to the aqua button tutorial a
   week or so from now

   doug: i'd like to do a follow up to the button tutorial but
   different
   ... try to start new telcon time in the new year

Summary of Action Items

   [NEW] ACTION: shepazu to publish version of HTML5 SVG syntax
   [recorded in
   [12]http://www.w3.org/2008/12/04-svgig-minutes.html#action01]

   [End of minutes]
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Received on Saturday, 6 December 2008 22:04:40 UTC