- From: Michael Hausenblas <michael.hausenblas@deri.org>
- Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 10:50:42 +0000
- To: Harry Halpin <hhalpin@ibiblio.org>, Christine Perey <cperey@perey.com>
- CC: 'Renato Iannella' <renato@nicta.com.au>, <public-social-web-talk@w3.org>, "'Appelquist, Daniel, VF-Group'" <Daniel.Appelquist@vodafone.com>
Harry, Christine, > Perhaps they are hoping this discussion will end soon. I do, and I am > wondering why we do not simply follow past successful models. +1 I've been silent for a long while, just to see where things are moving and I'm really afraid of the outcome. Please (potential) chairs, sit together on IRC, skype or whatever, hammer out a plan and present it to the interested parties. This is not about democracy. It is about darn setting the ball rolling. Good luck! Cheers, Michael -- Dr. Michael Hausenblas DERI - Digital Enterprise Research Institute National University of Ireland, Lower Dangan, Galway, Ireland, Europe Tel. +353 91 495730 http://sw-app.org/about.html http://webofdata.wordpress.com/ > From: Harry Halpin <hhalpin@ibiblio.org> > Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 05:39:15 -0500 (EST) > To: Christine Perey <cperey@perey.com> > Cc: 'Renato Iannella' <renato@nicta.com.au>, <public-social-web-talk@w3.org>, > "'Appelquist, Daniel, VF-Group'" <Daniel.Appelquist@vodafone.com> > Subject: RE: Proposal: Keep Group Unified, Don't Divide into Taskforces > Resent-From: <public-social-web-talk@w3.org> > Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 10:39:53 +0000 > > On Fri, 27 Feb 2009, Christine Perey wrote: > >> Hi Harry, >> >> Quickly: >> 1. Perhaps I am missing something but I really don't understand what is >> *new* in the proposals voiced on list this morning (compared with the >> proposals voiced by the same participants 40-50 days ago, sorry I don't have >> time to go digging those up). > > I am suggesting that we give up editing charter [2] as it is too big, do > not use task-forces, but try to cover the topics in a smaller charter with > more focussed deliverables. > >> A. We know that there is an experienced group of W3C editors and chairs >> who have good experience with small, focused groups and many cuts and >> bruises to indicate that the alternative (an inclusive charter) is a bad >> idea. And that you wish to spare us all the pain. >> It's great to have the experience and to learn from it, however, the >> future does not always, perfectly reflect the past. See point 2 which is in >> your favor. > > Given that I have seen only about 2 people argue for this, and most of the > list is silent, I see no reason why not. In particular, Incubator Groups > are supposed to be light-weight. > > >> B. The problem is that the group of potential participants has expanded >> vis a vis past W3C work charters. >> I believe that the consensus in response to a question posted to the >> list was (is) to have one XG (and there remain very good reasons for this) >> *AND* to include/embrace the many new activities which are appropriate and >> can be covered in the topic of Social Web XG. > > I believe you are not familiar with W3C process. The amount of > participants on this list (70 some) is not huge or abnormal. > >> Let's be clear: is your proposal (today, as in the past) that the data >> portability and interoperability in social network activities be conducted >> in a new XG [1] and that separate XGs (and mailing lists, and telecons, etc) >> be created for other all the other topics within scope? > > No, I am arguing that we have a single charter with a few deliverables, > and no unnecessary task force bureaucracy. That reflects the actual > partipation in the group. I think charter [1] can be revised to fit the > necessary topics. > >> Or are you suggesting that all other topics (see the task forces in >> [2]) be either (a) cast aside until those who have time/desire create new XG >> within W3C or (b) are not of interest to the W3C now or in the future? > > All these topics can be dealt with in a smaller number of deliverables. > Furthermore, the precise terms you have used to describe these topics are > a bit confusing to some people as well. Also, topics you have not covered > in your list, such as accessibility and internationalization, are actually > just as important as "contextual data" I think. > >> 2. Another thing which is NOT NEW (and worrisome) is that those on the list >> who have a stake in the outcome of this discussion/decision (more than I, >> certainly) are not expressing themselves. > > Perhaps they are hoping this discussion will end soon. I do, and I am > wondering why we do not simply follow past successful models. > > [1] http://esw.w3.org/topic/SocialWebXGCharter > [2] http://esw.w3.org/topic/UnifiedSocialXG >> >> 3. with regards to a mobile specific deliverable or a mobile-specific >> agenda, I will begin a separate thread. >> >> Christine >> >> cperey@perey.com >> mobile (Swiss): +41 79 436 68 69 >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: public-social-web-talk-request@w3.org >> [mailto:public-social-web-talk-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Harry Halpin >> Sent: Friday, February 27, 2009 9:54 AM >> To: Renato Iannella >> Cc: public-social-web-talk@w3.org >> Subject: Re: Proposal: Keep Group Unified, Don't Divide into Taskforces >> >> On Fri, 27 Feb 2009, Renato Iannella wrote: >> >>> >>> On 26 Feb 2009, at 19:57, Harry Halpin wrote: >>> >>>> I feel the proposed charter may be too large, due to having too many >>>> deliverables (15 at my last count). A smaller charter with (5) >>>> deliverables was written earlier. >>> >>> >>> I agree with Harry, and I indicated so earlier [1] - from my current >>> experiences in running an XG. >>> >>> This is not to say that what was has been proposed is not valuable, >>> but taken in the context of a W3C Incubator Group, the current scope >>> is significantly more than most W3C multi-year multi-working group >> Activities. >>> >>> Event the smaller charter [2] can be modified to include the core outputs: >>> 1 - Use Case/Requirements >>> 2 - State-of-the-Art Report (best practices) >>> 3 - Final Report (next steps) >>> >>> I also strongly believe that the Policy/Privacy/Trust work simply be >>> moved to the W3C PLING Interest Group (as argued in [1]) as the >>> evaluation of the XG Charter [3] stipulates: >> >> Note that I concur here, as PLING has extensive experience in this area. >> Another option is that PLING could write it in joint with the Social Web XG, >> if there are experts that are part of Social Web XG but not PLING. >> However, it might be simpler just to have those experts joing PLING. >> >> Second, we do have a few mobile phone people involved. In the smaller >> proposed charter [2] it might be feasible to add a report that focuses >> specifically on the future of *mobile* social networking. Although I >> strongly believe in one Web that steps across mobile and non-mobile >> boundaries, a report that details the advantages of mobile networking, >> accessibility, and how the W3C can co-ordinate future work in this area >> could be useful. However, in the second, larger proposed charter [2], there >> "contextual data" and "user experience" volunteers are missing, and the >> charter is basically empty. Perhaps there is a lack of interest from the >> mobile community, despite their heavy presence at the workshop? If not, now >> would be a good time to speak up. >> >> [1] http://esw.w3.org/topic/SocialWebXGCharter >> [2] http://esw.w3.org/topic/UnifiedSocialXG >> >> >>> "It is desirable to take ideas related to specific technology >>> solutions that are already being worked on elsewhere (within or >>> outside of the W3C) back to the place in which the work is taking place" >>> >>> I suspect this will be a major discussion point at the teleconference >>> next week. >>> >>> Cheers... Renato Iannella >>> NICTA >>> >>> [1] >>> <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-social-web-talk/2009Feb/00 >>> 46.html> [2] <http://esw.w3.org/topic/SocialWebXGCharter> >>> [3] <http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/about.html#Scope> >>> >> >> > > -- > --harry > > Harry Halpin > Informatics, University of Edinburgh > http://www.ibiblio.org/hhalpin >
Received on Friday, 27 February 2009 10:51:24 UTC