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[Minutes-Cov] 2016-05-18

From: Phil Archer <phila@w3.org>
Date: Wed, 18 May 2016 16:08:00 +0100
To: SDW WG Public List <public-sdw-wg@w3.org>
Message-ID: <fbd7952a-0780-7674-d8b0-2cfb4cd14f1f@w3.org>
The minutes of today's Coverages Sub Group meeting are at 
https://www.w3.org/2016/05/18-sdwcov-minutes with a text snapshot below.

ANU joins reading in being able to point to live demos, running code etc :-)


              Spatial Data on the Web WG Coverages Sub Group

18 May 2016

    [2]Agenda

       [2] 
https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Meetings:Coverage-Telecon20160518

    See also: [3]IRC log

       [3] http://www.w3.org/2016/05/18-sdwcov-irc

Attendees

    Present
           ByronCinNZ, billroberts, dmitrybrizhinev, duo, sam,
           phila, Maik, Rob, Atkinson, jonblower, kerry

    Regrets
           ScottSimmons

    Chair
           billroberts

    Scribe
           kerry

Contents

      * [4]Topics
          1. [5]Brief recap of previous meeting
          2. [6]Updates on example implementations: ANU
          3. [7]University of Reading/CoverageJSON
          4. [8]Requirements doc: presentation and review of draft
             by Bill
      * [9]Summary of Action Items
      * [10]Summary of Resolutions
      __________________________________________________________

    <scribe> scribe: kerry

    <billroberts> [11]https://www.w3.org/2016/05/04-sdwcov-minutes

      [11] https://www.w3.org/2016/05/04-sdwcov-minutes

    <scribe> scribeNick: kerry

    <scribe> chair: billroberts

    proposed: approve minutes
    [12]https://www.w3.org/2016/05/04-sdwcov-minutes

      [12] https://www.w3.org/2016/05/04-sdwcov-minutes

    <phila> +1

    <billroberts> +1

    <Duo> +1

    <Maik> +1

    +1

    RESOLUTION: approve minutes

    <billroberts>
    [13]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Patent_Call

      [13] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Patent_Call

    <billroberts>
    [14]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Meetings:Coverage-Tele
    con20160518

      [14] 
https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Meetings:Coverage-Telecon20160518

Brief recap of previous meeting

    <roba> thanks bill - will provide a very quick statement of
    intent

    billroberts: handy template for FPWD

Updates on example implementations: ANU

    <Duo> [15]http://anu-linked-earth-data.github.io/#/

      [15] http://anu-linked-earth-data.github.io/#/

    Duo: basic demo at link
    ... very simple client app, have taken a small landsat subset
    from agdc and loaded to jena and built client app to access
    data as rdf

    <Duo> [16]https://github.com/ANU-Linked-Earth-Data/ontology

      [16] https://github.com/ANU-Linked-Earth-Data/ontology

    Duo: data currently loaded dynamically as RDF datacube in Jena
    ... 2nd lin is ontology repository, shows datatime, resolution,
    band etc

    ,,,client app does basic time-based search over tiny data, can
    click on a particular area

    scribe: also a link button to link to data itself, but now a
    dummy
    ... looking for some more data and more complex queries and
    multiple bands

    jonblower: very nice, but didn't get is ontology describing
    pixes or a big binary blob?

    Duo: binary blobs becuase pixiels are too big -- we tested this
    and discussed at an elalier meeting

    <Maik> [17]Sample query

      [17] 
http://144.6.231.77/landsat/query?query=PREFIX%20xsd%3A%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2F2001%2FXMLSchema%23%3E%20PREFIX%20led%3A%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.example.org%2FANU-LED%23%3E%20SELECT%20%3Fsubject%20%3FgeoSparql%20%3FtimePeriod%20%3Fband%20%3Fimage%20%3Fresolution%20WHERE%20{%3Fsubject%20a%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fpurl.org%2Flinked-data%2Fcube%23Observation%3E.%20%3Fsubject%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.example.org%2FANU-LED%23imageData%3E%20%3Fimage.%20%3Fsubject%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.example.org%2FANU-LED%23etmBand%3E%20%3Fband.%20%3Fsubject%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.example.org%2FANU-LED%23bounds%3E%20%3FgeoSparql.%20%3Fsubject%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.example.org%2FANU-LED%23time%3E%20%3FtimePeriod.%20%3Fsubject%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.example.org%2FANU-LED%23resolution%3E%20%3Fresolution.%20Filter%28%3FtimePeriod%20%3D%20%222012-02-10T23%3A50%3A47.650696%2B00%3A00%22^^xsd%3AdateTime%29}ORDER%20BY%20DESC%28%3FtimePeriod%29%20LIMIT%2025

    billroberts: can we ss the rdf?

    duo: see query and json result here
    ... maik has posted [what?]

    billroberts: please post a link to the rdf

    roba: looking at ontology on link .. has a lot of axes
    concepts.. how does this realte to rdf datacube -- it is
    different

    dmitrybrizhinev: it inherits from rdf-datacube -- are you
    looking at right link?

    roba: maybe not

    <phila> I think it's
    [18]https://github.com/ANU-Linked-Earth-Data/ontology/blob/mast
    er/ANU-LED.owl

      [18] 
https://github.com/ANU-Linked-Earth-Data/ontology/blob/master/ANU-LED.owl

    <Maik> (my link works, just copy paste it in full, don't click
    on it)

    dmitrybrizhinev: you need to look at anuld

    billroberts: will take a proper look afterwards

    Duo: on top of that we had a chat with rob woodcock (AGDC)
    about uses of link data and coverage, and a similar chat with
    ed parsons
    ... Rob wants us to be smarter about queries e.g summer above
    tropic of capricorn
    ... or every second month
    ... does not like resampling becuase sicentists don't like it

    <roba> I have already captured these alternative use cases
    here:
    [19]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Data_cube_for_coverage

      [19] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Data_cube_for_coverage

    Duo: also meeting at ANU Fenner school wher eenvironmental data
    on a map was broken into "meaningful" regions
    ... ed wants to see restful APIs over SPARQL, things that
    startups can access

    phila: wnat to use some of this for the Chinese project report
    ... if I were not an rdfhead what is the point?

    duo: still early stages... describing data in a meaningful
    way.. by having it here can be easier to access.. heading
    towards resful approach without sparql

    phila: i see a column with diagonal black stripes -- what is
    this to a non-expert?

    Duo: this is an artifact of lansat -- many people want this -
    it is in the data
    ... if you don't want this this may not be what you want

    phila: want to tell people this is a good way to stitch them
    together

    jonblower: what do users need is a good question? yes
    scientists often want it close to original, but others want the
    over visual
    ... good to bring these issues out

    bill: creates rquirement for metadata

    roba: i know believe that we may not want to turn all inot
    rdfdatacube but this is a useful test of the competency of the
    model

    <phila> Kerry: There's a deeper question in there. The RDF QB
    is only appropriate for moderately well developed imagery as
    you're assuming it's laid out on a regular grid.

    <roba> rdf-QB does not assume a grid. its agnostic about
    dimensions

    <phila> ... There's a slightly deeper problem, it's not juyst
    about what has been done to the data. It's also about how far
    we go in saying what the satellite image shows.

    <phila> ... I'm happy with this though

    <phila> ... What is an appropriate data model for represetning
    coverage in general.

    <phila> Kerry: Not all coverages map into easy data models

    jonblower: convenient that AGDC is thinking about what level of
    pre-processing to do

    billroberts: we are going to have to deide if we need a suite
    of alternative solutions for say unprocessed towads that has
    been through a degree of processing

    <Zakim> phila, you wanted to make a quick aside about
    [20]https://www.w3.org/TR/2016/WD-dwbp-20160519/#EnrichData

      [20] https://www.w3.org/TR/2016/WD-dwbp-20160519/#EnrichData

    phila: discussion abouit various access to dat reminds me that
    DWBP doc that will be last call tomorrow and asking for reviews
    ... there is a BP on "data enrichment" and you need to say
    which value are processed and which are raw.
    ... hoping someone will look at this

    roba: my undertanding that rdf datacuibe does not require
    regular dimensions..i am looking at gridded things

    billroberts: yes, may be one-dimansional eg all the towns in
    australia

    jonblower: th3e other thing about users is that they can go
    from one type to the other but they need an entry point to
    start low and help people to ramp up
    ... by linking between representations and processing steps

University of Reading/CoverageJSON

    <Maik>
    [21]https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ceo-ld/2016May/
    0000.html

      [21] 
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ceo-ld/2016May/0000.html

    Maik: as on the CEO-Ld mailing list have added how to derive
    new data from existing data
    ... also how you can tile things over any dimension in our
    format

    <Maik>
    [22]https://github.com/Reading-eScience-Centre/coveragejson/iss
    ues/29#issuecomment-219984916

      [22] 
https://github.com/Reading-eScience-Centre/coveragejson/issues/29#issuecomment-219984916

    Maik: and how to define static subsets based on axis indices
    like the cube indices

    not finished yet

    <billroberts> Rob's wiki page:
    [23]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Data_cube_for_coverage

      [23] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Data_cube_for_coverage

    roba: joined OGC Europe on cisizen science observatories
    ... problem that cuts across SDW BP
    ... and a need to share resources
    ... developing a methodology for describing interoperability
    profiles, wanting to test and promote SDW BPs
    ... particularly want datacube descriptions to model large
    numbers of related datasets that realte spatially and
    temporally for citizen sciences to use
    ... want to test ideas coming from the group

    <phila> Kerry: We seem to have forgotten the linking issue

    <phila> ... It seems to have gone down in the list of things we
    need to deal with.

    <phila> ... Are we making this up and we don't need it, or is
    it really critical - which I think it is

    <phila> billroberts: I think it's important

    <phila> Kerry: I'm not hearing it in the discussion today

    <phila> billroberts: When I was working through the reqs, it
    does certainly come up in a lot of places

    <phila> ... Metadata bout Coverage datasets, you need a
    mechanism to add metadata

    <phila> roba: That's the basis of what we'll be demonstrating.
    using metadata to drive dynamic linking

    <phila> ... Finding all the slices and dices through the
    coverage which we see as a linking use case

    roba: want to use metadata to drive dynamic linking e.g. findin
    all slices and dices

    <phila> Kerry: Sounds like a discovery use case to me

    <phila> roba: That's a valid use of links

    jonblower: but the melodies reasons are data annotation and
    linking to vocabularies that describe properties

    billroberts: "omn the web" is important and sometimes its a
    simple as linked into a web page

    <billroberts>
    [24]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Coverage_draft_require
    ments

      [24] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Coverage_draft_requirements

Requirements doc: presentation and review of draft by Bill

    billroberts: worked through UCR document and also BP document
    ... worked through those high level requirements\
    ... particularly coverage extracts in a web frinedly way
    ... some things are clearer and some are not
    ... q+
    ... will continue to tidy up and give me your thoughts...

    and work through one issue at a time...

    scribe: classification of requirements, started with
    coverage-related and some that should be
    ... plus ones we brought up in meetings so far...

    billroberts: ... some things we might want to pick up on
    ... one thing is "discovery" e.g landsat archives
    ... not well solved at present for non-expert community
    ... another issues is identifiers for coverage extracts -- is
    such an identifier an aip spec for generating an extract
    ... or is it a thing?
    ... not possible to enumerate pre-prepared all possible
    exptracts, so you need some kind of api,

    <jonblower> got a lot of half-baked thoughts on this that we
    probably don't have time to go into today...

    billroberts: we also want to make sure we have a good
    connection to ssn strand of work

    <jonblower> (I mean I have, I wasn't minuting Bill's thoughts!)

    billroberts: seveal places we see that time is of equal status
    to spatial dimension
    ... some additional requirements not mentioned in UCR section
    ... also deciding what our target user groups are
    ... what is easy for some person is not so good for others
    ... planing to schedule a few of these per discussion

    <phila> Kerry: I had a look at the doc and had some ideas for
    little bits here and there.

    <phila> ... Can I suggest that you invite people to commnet on
    the doc in situ?

    <phila> ... I think it's better that people edit the wiki and
    attach their names/comment

    <phila> ... That might work better than e-mails with bits and
    pieces flying around.

    <phila> billroberts: +1

    billroberts: yes, please edit wiki directly, and use the "this
    is a minor edit" to not send emails if appropriate

    <phila> Wiki pages have a history tab so you can see who has
    done what

    billroberts: this is good for a frequent save strategy
    ... please stick you name on your comments
    ... BP meeting next
    ... any further comments?
    ... good stuff being done, thanks!

    <billroberts> bye

Summary of Action Items

Summary of Resolutions

     1. [25]approve minutes

    [End of minutes]
      __________________________________________________________
Received on Wednesday, 18 May 2016 15:08:38 UTC

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