W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-rqtf@w3.org > November 2021

Re: CAPTCHA Update--Providing CloudFlare Reference

From: Janina Sajka <janina@rednote.net>
Date: Mon, 8 Nov 2021 22:26:03 -0500
To: "White, Jason J" <jjwhite@ets.org>
Cc: Scott Hollier <scott@hollier.info>, "public-rqtf@w3.org" <public-rqtf@w3.org>
Message-ID: <YYnqSxO3BUKyDKgR@rednote.net>
I do think we have the cleanest definition. But, I'd like to see WCAG
align with us, rather than us being pushed to align with WCAG's less
than fully accurate definition.

White, Jason J writes:
> I just checked the introduction, and it appears that we don’t define CAPTCHA beyond expanding the acronym and giving some examples. Thus, we may not need to coordinate on definitions, in as much as we don’t introduce any in this document.
> 
> From: Janina Sajka <janina@rednote.net>
> Date: Monday, November 8, 2021 at 18:33
> To: Scott Hollier <scott@hollier.info>
> Cc: White, Jason J <jjwhite@ets.org>, public-rqtf@w3.org <public-rqtf@w3.org>
> Subject: Re: CAPTCHA Update--Providing CloudFlare Reference
> Dear All:
> 
> Please also note there's an effort now underway in WAI Coordination
> (with Judy) to harmonize definitions across various WAI publications. I
> don't believe this need hold up our FPWD, but we should probably work to
> resolve the definition of CAPTCHA with AGWG before attempting to elevate
> our updated draft to W3C Statement status.
> 
> So, just another item for the todo list!
> 
> Easiest way for me to point you to the collection of terms created so
> far for harmonization is to point you to the Silver Conformance Options
> subgroup definitions wiki here:
> 
> https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FWAI%2FGL%2Ftask-forces%2Fsilver%2Fwiki%2FConformance_Glossary_Candidates%23WAI-Wide_Glossary_Harmomization&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=kndx%2F0QLkQoJ561JCAQSF6j9VU0g4wnwB2S9ProcNl8%3D&amp;reserved=0
> 
> Best,
> 
> Janina
> 
> Scott Hollier writes:
> > To Janina
> >
> > I've had a look at the work - your proposal makes sense to me and is a good addition.
> >
> > Scott.
> >
> >
> > Dr Scott Hollier
> > Digital Access Specialist
> > Mobile: +61 (0)430 351 909
> > Web: https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.hollier.info%2F&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=tDHaoqvA2HwbCmtIJKmO8agI3pKkqY54M06Lg%2BdHsBc%3D&amp;reserved=0
> >
> > Technology for everyone
> >
> > Keep up with digital access news by following @scotthollier on Twitter.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Janina Sajka <janina@rednote.net>
> > Sent: Friday, 5 November 2021 1:56 AM
> > To: White, Jason J <jjwhite@ets.org>
> > Cc: public-rqtf@w3.org
> > Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: CAPTCHA Update--Providing CloudFlare Reference
> >
> > Thanks, Jason.
> >
> > Afaik, this Cloud Flare work is the only content we need to incorporate in an FPWD publication. I'm proposing to try and get that done in time for consideration by RQTF at our next call on the 17th. Potentially, we could even resolve to ask APA to publish at that point.
> >
> > Is that unreasonable? I'm not aware of other major work or industry changes re CAPTCHA since our 2019 Note. Thus, I think adding Cloud Flare to our note would constitute a worthy FPWD.
> >
> > Janina
> >
> > White, Jason J writes:
> > > With apologies, I should have searched further before writing my earlier message.
> > >
> > > Here’s the explanation of the scheme based on zero-knowledge proofs.
> > > https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fblog.cloudflare.com%2Fintroducing-zero-knowledge-proofs-for-priv&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=%2FfdTHTvoymh1Wjn%2BYFZFY88Cnrhs2yPDPuOg1uD43dw%3D&amp;reserved=0
> > > ate-web-attestation-with-cross-multi-vendor-hardware/
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > >
> > > Jason.
> > >
> > > From: White, Jason J <jjwhite@ets.org>
> > > Date: Thursday, 1 June, 2021 at 13:15
> > > To: Janina Sajka <janina@rednote.net>, public-rqtf@w3.org
> > > <public-rqtf@w3.org>
> > > Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: CAPTCHA Update--Providing CloudFlare Reference
> > > CAUTION: This email originated from outside of our organization. Do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe.
> > > Thank you, Janina. Here’s the more detailed, technical treatment of the proposal.
> > > https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fblog.cloudflare.com%2Fintroducing-cryptographic-attestation-of-p&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=0l4oMa8pekZSiMKLk4o7QyPG2TT3POdHIJzY4HYbPl0%3D&amp;reserved=0
> > > ersonhood/<https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%253
> > > A%2F%2Fblog.cloudflare.com%2Fintroducing-cryptographic-attestation-of-
> > > personhood%2F&data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cbaf3e67086b9416107340
> > > 8d99fb6a0f7%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C6377164290084
> > > 15324%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJB
> > > TiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=Btp%2ByHWd7P%2BxVc1PzEAdnnLKEW
> > > PWkXNCHdwuowNHlik%3D&reserved=0>
> > >
> > > Note also the suggestion toward the end of the article that a zero-knowledge proof-based scheme is also contemplated, with details forthcoming.
> > >
> > > We’ll need to consider updating the CAPTCHA note accordingly. Is the following process in accord with your understanding of what is needed?
> > >
> > >
> > >   1.  Revise the Note and obtain appropriate review.
> > >   2.  Republish as a Working Group Note, if approved at a Call for Consensus.
> > >   3.  Request elevation to W3C Statement status.
> > > Regards,
> > >
> > > Jason.
> > >
> > > From: Janina Sajka <janina@rednote.net>
> > > Date: Wednesday, 1 June, 2021 at 16:43
> > > To: public-rqtf@w3.org <public-rqtf@w3.org>
> > > Subject: CAPTCHA Update--Providing CloudFlare Reference
> > > Colleagues:
> > >
> > > Here's the ZD Net article about Cloud Flare's desire to kill CAPTCHA I
> > > was referring to on today's call:
> > >
> > > https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.
> > > zdnet.com%2Farticle%2Fcloudflare-wants-to-kill-the-captcha%2F&amp;data
> > > =04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C9abc6328397f4332ec3408d99f0a8938%7C0ba6
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> > > kTw%3D&amp;reserved=0<https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?
> > > url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.zdnet.com%2Farticle%2Fcloudflare-wants-to-kill-t
> > > he-captcha%2F&data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cbaf3e67086b9416107340
> > > 8d99fb6a0f7%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C6377164290084
> > > 15324%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJB
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> > > ociVEMNPccpg8%3D&reserved=0>
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > Janina Sajka
> > > https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flink
> > > edin.com%2Fin%2Fjsajka&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C9abc6328
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> > > iV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C2000&amp;sdata=slQTcxZ2kgI75
> > > cBFF7sEJLaTWwny2aUMZ0SICrujGZU%3D&amp;reserved=0<https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fnam10.safelin%2F&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=1vbsTz8hqpVRJAD9Ofutgr0JlHVyaFh8g8sJmU9PRFI%3D&amp;reserved=0
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> > > a&data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cbaf3e67086b94161073408d99fb6a0f7%
> > > 7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637716429008425320%7CUnkn
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> > >
> > > Linux Foundation Fellow
> > > Executive Chair, Accessibility Workgroup:       https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fa11y.org%2F&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=ogD1jF2CNQRiCMPyf04cr5oBFSBV4id7OWqjbX4HJl0%3D&amp;reserved=0<https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fa11y.org%2F&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=ogD1jF2CNQRiCMPyf04cr5oBFSBV4id7OWqjbX4HJl0%3D&amp;reserved=0><https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fa11y.org%2F&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=ogD1jF2CNQRiCMPyf04cr5oBFSBV4id7OWqjbX4HJl0%3D&amp;reserved=0%3chttps://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fa11y.org%2F&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=ogD1jF2CNQRiCMPyf04cr5oBFSBV4id7OWqjbX4HJl0%3D&amp;reserved=0%3e>
> > >
> > > The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
> > > Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures     https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2Fwai%2Fapa&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=pYYaCC43p%2BUR5AKtlH73i9f%2BzRx9gXTqTRQ%2FIcx7gjs%3D&amp;reserved=0<https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2Fwai%2Fapa&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=pYYaCC43p%2BUR5AKtlH73i9f%2BzRx9gXTqTRQ%2FIcx7gjs%3D&amp;reserved=0><https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2Fwai%2Fapa&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=pYYaCC43p%2BUR5AKtlH73i9f%2BzRx9gXTqTRQ%2FIcx7gjs%3D&amp;reserved=0%3chttps://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2Fwai%2Fapa&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=pYYaCC43p%2BUR5AKtlH73i9f%2BzRx9gXTqTRQ%2FIcx7gjs%3D&amp;reserved=0%3e>
> > >
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> > >
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> > >
> > >
> > > Thank you for your compliance.
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > >
> > > This e-mail and any files transmitted with it may contain privileged or confidential information. It is solely for use by the individual for whom it is intended, even if addressed incorrectly. If you received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender; do not disclose, copy, distribute, or take any action in reliance on the contents of this information; and delete it from your system. Any other use of this e-mail is prohibited.
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> > >
> > > Thank you for your compliance.
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> >
> > --
> >
> > Janina Sajka
> > https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flinkedin.com%2Fin%2Fjsajka&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=WOW0PQbCMAqogwVcmmIAZ3SmnltHn11xwkelhOOM8Hw%3D&amp;reserved=0
> >
> > Linux Foundation Fellow
> > Executive Chair, Accessibility Workgroup:     https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fa11y.org%2F&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=ogD1jF2CNQRiCMPyf04cr5oBFSBV4id7OWqjbX4HJl0%3D&amp;reserved=0
> >
> > The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
> > Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures   https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2Fwai%2Fapa&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195761137%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=pYYaCC43p%2BUR5AKtlH73i9f%2BzRx9gXTqTRQ%2FIcx7gjs%3D&amp;reserved=0
> >
> >
> 
> --
> 
> Janina Sajka
> https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flinkedin.com%2Fin%2Fjsajka&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195771125%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=nduIG8OcOZVumohbDVPgm95qah1n0SkbWvsKE8UhQRA%3D&amp;reserved=0
> 
> Linux Foundation Fellow
> Executive Chair, Accessibility Workgroup:       https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fa11y.org%2F&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195771125%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=ls5GMG54AttkwjaN%2BjbygtRQuHxeLZ1idMuFLnLAbVk%3D&amp;reserved=0
> 
> The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
> Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures     https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2Fwai%2Fapa&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cade388c4ec53427d4ae008d9a3102fc6%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637720112195771125%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=98H2Qug4YjLF82mPvod93jogMwkca4xLCbA8qWvI8bU%3D&amp;reserved=0
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-- 

Janina Sajka
https://linkedin.com/in/jsajka

Linux Foundation Fellow
Executive Chair, Accessibility Workgroup:	http://a11y.org

The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures	http://www.w3.org/wai/apa
Received on Tuesday, 9 November 2021 03:26:20 UTC

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