RE: [RIF][SWC] ACTION: JosDeBruijn create a wiki pageexplainingthe issue with bNode semantic [DONE]

Apologies I misunderstood: 
+1

Paul Vincent
Fair Isaac Blaze Advisor --- Business Rule Management
OMG Standards for Business Rules, PRR & BPMI
mobile: +44 (0)781 493 7229 ... office: +44 (0)20 7871 7229 

-----Original Message-----
From: Jos de Bruijn [mailto:jos.debruijn@deri.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 4:56 PM
To: Vincent, Paul D
Cc: public-rif-wg@w3.org
Subject: RE: [RIF][SWC] ACTION: JosDeBruijn create a wiki pageexplainingthe issue with bNode semantic [DONE]


> > A few qus:
> 
> > 1. Wondering why this is an issue: would it be useful to add some
> links on the general issues of mapping RDF to/from the more common IT
> data models eg XML? [Many commercial rule representations interpret
> XML/XST models as "object models" rather than supporting RDF
> directly].
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> XML is merely a structured way for representing data, but does not
> carry
> any semantic commitments.
> RDF does have some semantic commitment.
> 
> Therefore, one cannot map, in general, between RDF and some XML
> representation, other than using XML to serialize RDF, as is done, for
> example, with RDF/XML.
>  
> 
> PV> Is RIF limited ONLY to Semantic Web / RDF applications? Most
> operational IT systems are not RDF based. Therefore this is a major
> limitation if true. There is no reason (except maybe performance) why
> other operational data formats should not be translated via RDF,
> presumably, although they will be semantically "lighter". Certainly
> not all use cases require complex semantics.


I'm definitely not saying all data which is "consumed" and "produced" by
RIF rules should be RDF. Certainly all data could be translated to RDF,
but personally I think this required nor desirable.
My point is that we need to be able to work with RDF data, besides all
other data which we might want to "consume" (I actually assume that
most, if not all, other data can be represented as RIF facts).


Best, Jos

> 
>  
> 
> > 2. Presumably the issue of RDF comes up in whether or not RIF will
> also handle interchange of data representation mechanisms (eg XML vs
> RDF) as well as expression and general rule semantics. [Will I need to
> interchange between a rule defined against RDF data with a rule
> defined against some XML data?].
> 
>  
> 
> The issue with RDF compatibility comes up as soon as you use RDF data
> in
> 
> your rules. RIF is a *Semantic Web* (language/interchange
> 
> format/whatever), so we need to be able to cope with RDF data somehow.
> 
>  
> 
> I'm not sure how XML data would fit in here. If you use RDF/XML for
> 
> representing RDF, you use XML. You might also use some XML
> 
> representation to represent ground RIF facts.
> 
>  
> 
> PV> Yes, this might be off topic: mapping "operational" data types
> (like Java object models, XML data etc) to RIF and/or RDF...  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Best, Jos
> 
>  
> 
> > 
> 
> > Thx.
> 
> > 
> 
> > Paul Vincent
> 
> > Fair Isaac Blaze Advisor --- Business Rule Management
> 
> > OMG Standards for Business Rules, PRR & BPMI
> 
> > mobile: +44 (0)781 493 7229 ... office: +44 (0)20 7871 7229 
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> 
> > From: public-rif-wg-request@w3.org
> [mailto:public-rif-wg-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Jos de Bruijn
> 
> > Sent: Monday, February 06, 2006 7:21 PM
> 
> > To: public-rif-wg@w3.org
> 
> > Subject: [RIF][SWC] ACTION: JosDeBruijn create a wiki page
> explaining the issue with bNode semantic [DONE]
> 
> > 
> 
> > 
> 
> > >From the actions in the last telecon:
> 
> > 
> 
> > [PENDING] ACTION: JosDeBruijn create a wiki page explaining the
> issue
> 
> > with bNode semantics and summarize the possible solutions which have
> 
> > come up during the discussions on the mailing list [recorded in
> 
> > http://www.w3.org/2006/01/31-rif-minutes.html#action15]
> 
> > 
> 
> > is DONE.
> 
> > 
> 
> > Find the Wiki page here:
> 
> > http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/wiki/bNode_Semantics
> 
> > 
> 
> > I created a link from the RDF_Compatibility page.
> 
> > 
> 
> > Comments are very welcome!
> 
> > 
> 
> > 
> 
> > Best, Jos
> 
> > --
> 
> > Jos de Bruijn,        http://www.debruijn.net/
> 
> > +43 512 507 6475         jos.debruijn@deri.org
> 
> > 
> 
> > DERI                      http://www.deri.org/
> 
> > ----------------------------------------------
> 
> > Knowledge is power.
> 
> >   - Sir Francis Bacon
> 
> > 
> 
> > 
> 
> > 
> 
> --
> 
> Jos de Bruijn,        http://www.debruijn.net/
> 
> +43 512 507 6475         jos.debruijn@deri.org
> 
>  
> 
> DERI                      http://www.deri.org/
> 
> ----------------------------------------------
> 
> Things are more like they are now than they have ever been.
> 
>   - Gerald R. Ford
> 
>  
> 
> 
--
Jos de Bruijn,        http://www.debruijn.net/
+43 512 507 6475         jos.debruijn@deri.org

DERI                      http://www.deri.org/
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Received on Tuesday, 7 February 2006 17:02:01 UTC