- From: Mark Birbeck <mark.birbeck@webbackplane.com>
- Date: Thu, 1 Jul 2010 23:26:32 +0100
- To: Shane McCarron <shane@aptest.com>
- Cc: Ivan Herman <ivan@w3.org>, W3C RDFa WG <public-rdfa-wg@w3.org>
Hi Shane, Understood...but the EARL vocabulary really is ideal for what we want (see other email), and is certainly richer than what we have. Regards, Mark On Thu, Jul 1, 2010 at 3:55 PM, Shane McCarron <shane@aptest.com> wrote: > Gentlemen... > > Remembering that I know nothing about RDF, and I *still* don't believe in > the semantic web... I think I get that there is a possibility that we could > piggy-back on other vocabularies... but we ALREADY HAVE an RDFa Vocabulary. > Its a simple vocabulary, and extending it with a couple of additional terms > seems perfectly reasonable to me. Certainly more reasonable than trying to > shoehorn our requirements into the EARL vocabulary - I shouldn't have to > squint and turn my head in order to understand that a triple means 'RDFa > Processor Error'. What am I missing here? > > On 7/1/2010 8:58 AM, Ivan Herman wrote: >> >> So... (just in time for the telco) >> >> First of all, I looked at the Earl and related documentation again, and >> then had a chat with Shadi Abu-Zahra, who is the staff contact in the >> relevant group and also co-editor of EARL. >> >> First of all, EARL is in second last call. This means that while it is >> possible to have some editorial changes in the document, he does not think >> it is possible to make substantial changes, eg, changing attribute and class >> names. Then we went through the issues and we agreed that some classes (eg, >> assertor, assertion) could be used for error handling purposes while >> slightly changing the text description of those classes (it currently says, >> for Assertion "a statement that embodies the results of a test." But we also >> agreed that the term 'test' does not really apply for what we do in RDFa >> and, unfortunately, the terms used for most of the properties and classes do >> refer to tests all over the place. Not only the class and property names >> often refer to tests (TestResult, TestSubject, test,...) but the properties >> have range and domain definition that often refer to these classes, ie, by >> using them, we would assert certain classes to be, say, Test results, when >> in reality they aren't. >> >> What I did is to go again through all these documents and changed what we >> have. It is on the wiki, to make it quicker, it is reproduced here (also >> using some of Mark's example): >> >> <#assertor> a earl:Assertor, earl:Software, foaf:Agent ; >> foaf:name "RDFa Distiller" ; >> dc:description "RDFa Distiller Service" ; >> foaf:homepage<http://www.w3.org/2007/08/pyRdfa/> ; >> dc:hasVersion "2.3.5" . >> >> [] a earl:Assertion ; >> earl:assertedBy<#assertor> ; >> rdfa:subject<http://www.example.org> ; >> rdfa:error [ >> a rdfa:ProfileReferenceError ; >> dc:description "The @profile value could not be deferenced" ; >> dc:date "2010-06-30T13:40"^^xsd:dateTime ; >> rdfa:onUri<http://www.example.org/profile> ; >> rdfa:pointer [ >> ptr:reference<http://www.example.org> ; >> # if exact pointer information can be provided here... >> ] >> ] . >> >> I used the pointer from Mark's example, though I am not sure this could be >> universally used. Eg, my distiller runs a DOM parser on the source, so the >> line and character number is completely lost by the time error is managed. >> >> The rdfa specific properties are needed to replace their earl equivalents >> but without a range/domain specification; here is the schema: >> >> rdfa:Error rdfs:subClassOf earl:OutcomeValue . >> >> rdfa:ProfileReferenceError rdfs:subClassOf rdfa:Error . >> >> # More classes come here... >> rdfa:error a owl:objectProperty ; >> rdfs:domain earl:Assertion ; >> rdfs:comment "much like earl:result, but is range is not TestResult" >> >> rdfa:subject a owl:objectProperty ; >> rdfs:comment "much like an earl:subject, but its range is >> not set to be a test subject" ; >> >> rdfa:pointer a owl:objectProperty ; >> rdfs:comment "much like earl:pointer, but its domain >> is not set to TestResult" . >> >> B.t.w., I agreed with Shadi that he would look at the RDFa vocabulary when >> we think it is closer to final. >> >> Ivan >> >> >> On Jun 30, 2010, at 18:01 , Mark Birbeck wrote: >> >> >>> >>> Hi Ivan, >>> >>> >>>> >>>> Well, I do not agree with that. Running a retrieval service is not >>>> conceptually > >>>> a validation for me. If a @profile is temporarily down, because, say, >>>> its holder >>>> machine is down, that this is not a validation error at all, it is a >>>> temporary >>>> network of hardware problem that does affect the graph you get at a >>>> moment >>>> it time which is otherwise perfectly valid. EARL is made to the >>>> management >>>> of tests and their results; that has nothing to do in my view with what >>>> we are >>>> discussing here... >>>> >>>> I am absolutely not pushing for our own vocabulary for the purpose of >>>> having... >>>> our own vocabulary. But I have not found anything used for our own >>>> purposes. >>>> I do not believe EARL is appropriate. >>>> >>> >>> I have to say I'm surprised that you say this. :) >>> >>> EARL is so close to what we're defining here that it was pretty much >>> made for the job! It may lack some precision in the terminology, but >>> we have choices there. We could: >>> >>> * live with the slight lack of precision; >>> * sub-class from the terms we don't like, to create something more >>> accurate; >>> * work with the 'EARL community' to add additional terms that address >>> parsing. >>> >>> Each of these options is preferable to creating a bunch of new terms >>> that don't really have any essential organising principle. >>> >>> Anyway, I guess we can discuss this on the telecon, but I'm really >>> against the vocabulary explosion that seems to be underway here; even >>> if we don't like EARL, we should still try to use more FOAF and DC so >>> as to keep to a minimum the number of terms that need to be invented. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Mark >>> >>> -- >>> Mark Birbeck, webBackplane >>> >>> mark.birbeck@webBackplane.com >>> >>> http://webBackplane.com/mark-birbeck >>> >>> webBackplane is a trading name of Backplane Ltd. (company number >>> 05972288, registered office: 2nd Floor, 69/85 Tabernacle Street, >>> London, EC2A 4RR) >>> >> >> ---- >> Ivan Herman, W3C Semantic Web Activity Lead >> Home: http://www.w3.org/People/Ivan/ >> mobile: +31-641044153 >> PGP Key: http://www.ivan-herman.net/pgpkey.html >> FOAF: http://www.ivan-herman.net/foaf.rdf >> >> >> >> >> >> > > -- > Shane P. McCarron Phone: +1 763 786-8160 x120 > Managing Director Fax: +1 763 786-8180 > ApTest Minnesota Inet: shane@aptest.com > > > > >
Received on Thursday, 1 July 2010 22:27:05 UTC