Re: RDF* vs RDF vs named graphs

On Dec 1, 2020, at 07:33 PM, thomas lörtsch <tl@rat.io> wrote:
> 
> RDF* is about annotating statements that actually have been
> stated.

Except that RDF* also ASSERTS those statements, as has been 
said many times... (I think I'm talking about RDF*-PG here, 
not RDF*-SA, nor "Classic" a/k/a "Original Recipe" a/k/a 
"from the first paper" RDF*, but I get all these mixed up 
rather a lot, so correction is welcome.) 

{ :Alice :said << :Bill :hates :Bob >> . }

-- does not merely assert that :Alice said something; it 
also automagically asserts --

{ :Bill :hates :Bob . } 

It seems that that is treated as a *TRUTH*, a *FACT*, simply 
because it's been asserted (or, I would say, uttered) -- just 
as an embedded triple! -- in RDF*-PG.

It doesn't matter that *I* do not wish to assert the latter,
only to assert that :Alice asserted it. There seems to be no 
way for me to assert some else's assertion without making the 
same assertion myself -- and that is a HUGE problem with RDF*-PG.

It's bad enough that people have treated (and continue to do 
so!) treat *anything* asserted in RDF as universal and perpetual 
truths.

{ :redLight :means :go . :greenLight :means :stop }

{ :outdoors :temperature "36 degrees Fahrenheit"}

{ :moon :madeOf :cheeseGreen . }

{ :pigs :have :wings . }

*BAM*

World ends.  (OK, it just gets really messy for a little while.)

Of course, the :redLight actually means :stop, and the :greenLight
actually means :go, but the reverse has now been asserted (not 
merely uttered, because nothing is every merely uttered) in RDF, 
and RDF assertions are true facts, forever and ever, amen.

Oh, wait, *anything* can be expressed in RDF, *including* lies.

(This point gets glossed over every time I raise it. No matter
what group hears/reads it, Truthtellers are not the only ones
who can scribble Turtle, JSON-LD, RDF/XML, etc.)

Which is why we need a way to talk about individual triples as 
well as the graphs and/or documents in which those triples occur.

So that we can say that :Mary who originally noted that 
{ << :Bill :hates :Bob >> :saidBy :Alice . } is a notorious
gossip, treating the truthfulness of what she says as entirely
optional. Fact is, :Alice *did* say that { :Bill :hates :Bob . } 
but she was joking, teasing :Bill who hasn't yet told :Bob that
he has a crush on him. In other words, the *truth* is that 
{ :Bill :likes :Bob . } (and { :Alice :likes :Bill , :Bob } ).


> There is one exception: the case when in SA mode an embedded 
> statement doesn’t reflect an actual occurrence. But this is
> a corner case, a niche usecase - although definitely an
> important one IMO.


I trust that the examples above reveal that this is NOT just
"a corner case, a niche usecase", but a vital element of 
discourse, regardless of the arena hosting that discourse.



Oh, by the way -- check out the results of a couple of Google
searches.  Note that while something mentioning RDF* does
appear on the first page of results, *most* of those hits,
most especially including the giant sidebar callout, are about 
the "unrelated" _RDF (no-star)_, *not* about RDF*.

   https://www.google.com/search?q=RDF*

   https://www.google.com/search?q="RDF*"


A better name for this project really is a *MUST* if it is to 
be carried through to a formal specification/recommendation,
whether RFC or W3 TR or otherwise.

Regards,

Ted



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