- From: Manu Sporny <msporny@digitalbazaar.com>
- Date: Wed, 09 Jan 2008 21:31:16 -0500
- To: RDFa mailing list <public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf@w3.org>
First, I do believe that Mark's approach is the proper way to do things from a programming/engineering/graph theory perspective. Everybody that I've heard explain RDF/N3 have said that a triple is: SUBJECT PREDICATE OBJECT . If we assume that people will understand that @about/@href/@resource can be used to set the subject OR object (depending on whether or not you're chaining), then there are no issues. Unfortunately, I don't think many will understand that rather advanced concept until they've been immersed in RDFa for several months. The danger is: What happens if people don't understand that? My initial thought on "accidental" triple generation was: "Too bad, that's what the markup states. They'll get burned, they'll learn and they'll fix their markup. They should learn how to use RDFa properly. They should understand what they're typing." Ben's rules makes it harder to generate triples accidentally, as well as simplifying what can/can't generate a triple. This is at the cost of slightly more verbose markup and a compromise on orthogonality between what @about/@src/@href/@resource can do. Mark's rules are very powerful and @about/@src/@href/@resource are quite orthogonal. In a way, they are simpler to explain... but harder to truly grasp without a basic understanding of graph theory. You can express things very succinctly, the danger being that you might generate something you didn't mean to. Mark Birbeck wrote: > So no-one is proposing an alternate model to mine, they are just > suggesting that some of the formulations that my model enables should > be prescribed. In that case, perhaps we can look at the issue assuming that the decision we are about to make is going to be disastrous. Scenario #1: We go with Mark's rules. Ben is right. Spurious triples are generated on a widespread scale, HTML markup must be changed drastically to incorporate RDFa. Outcome: Bloggers start unknowingly creating a large volume of spurious triples that express the wrong relationships, thinking that they understand which triples they are creating. They don't check their work, they're lazy. The semantic web becomes a sea of triples... half are correct, half are absolutely wrong. How do we fix it: Replace Mark's rules with Ben's rules in RDFa 2.0... all of a sudden tons of triples disappear off of web pages (because people will probably just change the DOCTYPE at the top of the page - or people are using tag-soup parsers). The publishers that were using Mark's rules properly are very annoyed that they just sporadically lost 3 years worth of triples - they don't know which ones they lost because it is impossible to check automatically. Scenario #2: We go with Ben's rules. Mark is right. Publishers have a much harder time expressing semantics succinctly using RDFa. Outcome: Triples aren't being generated because blogger's aren't using the proper markup. Bloggers complain that RDFa is difficult to use because @href/@resource don't do what is expected... it's also too verbose, adoption is slow. How do we fix it: Education and tools that generate the proper triples. If we have to, Ben's rules are replaced with Mark's rules in RDFa 2.0. However, we will have a ton of real-world use cases to see if Mark's rules would actually help or hurt matters at that point. So, while I partially agree with Mark's approach, I can't support it because of the two disaster scenarios I've outlined above. Ben's rules are going to be less harmful in the long run if we're wrong. Most importantly, the semantic web can recover from Ben's rules. If there is a place to be cautious about "accidental" triple generation, it is in version 1.0 of RDFa. And if people complain about not being able to use @href/@resource to complete a triple, we have a great answer for them: "Then you're going to love the @href/@resource upgrade in RDFa v2.0!" :) -- manu -- Manu Sporny President/CEO - Digital Bazaar, Inc. blog: Intro to the Semantic Web in 6 minutes (video) http://blog.digitalbazaar.com/2007/12/26/semantic-web-intro
Received on Thursday, 10 January 2008 02:31:22 UTC