- From: Ivan Herman <ivan@w3.org>
- Date: Mon, 7 Aug 2017 11:40:43 +0200
- To: Fabrizio Venerandi <fabrizio.venerandi@quintadicopertina.com>
- Cc: Luc Audrain <LAUDRAIN@hachette-livre.fr>, W3C Publishing Working Group <public-publ-wg@w3.org>
Fabrizio, it is indeed preferable if your comments were registered as comments on github issues (or, if applicable, as completely new issues), rather than separate discussions on the mailing list. Thanks! Ivan > On 7 Aug 2017, at 11:02, Fabrizio Venerandi <fabrizio.venerandi@quintadicopertina.com> wrote: > > Thank you for the answer and link to the thread I missed. > I’ll read all the discussion and the github issue. > > > Fabrizio > > >> Il giorno 07 ago 2017, alle ore 10:30, AUDRAIN LUC <LAUDRAIN@hachette-livre.fr> ha scritto: >> >> Copying the W3C Publishing Working Group. >> >> I encourage you to read the mail thread « definition of Web Publication » >> where this has been discussed. >> There is also a github issue open by Dave Cramer [1] where you could >> contribute. >> >> Luc >> >> [1] https://github.com/w3c/wpub/issues/14 >> >> >> >> Le 07/08/2017 09:47, « Fabrizio Venerandi » >> <fabrizio.venerandi@quintadicopertina.com> a écrit : >> >>> Hi, >>> >>> I think “no default” could be the better option. What is the “default >>> order” in Wikipedia, for example? >>> The problems with having an "order by default” are imho two: >>> >>> a) with a default order "by default” (sorry) the digital publication is >>> still designed as a “book”. So we will have more “digitalised books” >>> instead “digital publications”. >>> >>> b) the bigger one: I fear the reader’s support for non linear digital >>> publications will still be a mess. I’m not only talking about the >>> problems for have “closed islands” of information connected only by link, >>> but also of the inappropriate technologies about rendering. For example: >>> Ibooks, when a ebook is opened, is pre-paging all the ebook in >>> background. This is cool for a “digitalised book”, but is inappropiate >>> for a digital publications. Why paginate “pages” I’ll never reach? And >>> what if, in "first page", I touch a link that brings me in the "last >>> page" of the DP? The "default order” forces Ibooks to paginate the ebook >>> following it, "page after page" and not the order the reader will use >>> moving inside the publication. The concept of “first page” or “last page” >>> in a digital publication is quite silly. >>> >>> Fabrizio >>> >>> >>>> Il giorno 07 ago 2017, alle ore 09:22, AUDRAIN LUC >>>> <LAUDRAIN@hachette-livre.fr> ha scritto: >>>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> When you say « a digital publication that allow *multiple* reading order >>>> by default », which one is he default? >>>> Or do you mean there is no default? >>>> >>>> The possibly of multiple reading order is an interesting use case. >>>> I don¹t see that having one by default hinder that possibility. >>>> >>>> Luc >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Le 07/08/2017 08:56, « Fabrizio Venerandi » >>>> <fabrizio.venerandi@quintadicopertina.com> a écrit : >>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> I¹d like to share my perplexity about the recent definition about the >>>>> reading order in digital publication: >>>>> >>>>> ³The default reading order is the static progression through the >>>>> primary >>>>> resources defined in the manifest by the creator of a Web Publication. >>>>> A >>>>> user might follow alternative pathways through the content, but in the >>>>> absence of such interaction the default reading order defines the >>>>> expected progression from one primary resource to the next.² >>>>> >>>>> Our publisher house is creating ebooks in ePub from 2010, and one of >>>>> big >>>>> limit in creating native digital ebook is the ³book² notion of ³default >>>>> reading order². There is not a ³default reading order² in a website, >>>>> but >>>>> I need to allow one in a digital publication. This prevents me to build >>>>> an ebook with several different "reading order² without the risk the >>>>> reader can fall from one to another one. I can not set a rule for a >>>>> chapter for ³don't go in another chapter when the user turn the last >>>>> page². So, I can use the atomic complexity of a website for a digital >>>>> publication, but I have to pray the user will use my hyperlink and does >>>>> not turn the pages, because I have to ³flat down² my atomic resource >>>>> to a >>>>> linear book. Also, the concept of ³default reading order² caused a lot >>>>> a >>>>> misunderstanding for how handle the ³non default² chapters in ebook. >>>>> The >>>>> Œlinear-no¹ support in ePub and EPUB3 is a mess: someone handles it as >>>>> a >>>>> pop-up, someone like a normal chapter (but does not remember the page I >>>>> was reading if I close the ebook), someone like a separate atom (but >>>>> if I >>>>> turn the last page I will ³fall² in another chapter), someone does not >>>>> support linear-no at all. Et ceterae. >>>>> >>>>> I hope the working group could still think about a digial pubblication >>>>> that allow *multiple* reading order by default, and not a single one. >>>>> >>>>> Thank you. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Fabrizio Venerandi >>>> >>> >> > > ---- Ivan Herman, W3C Publishing@W3C Technical Lead Home: http://www.w3.org/People/Ivan/ mobile: +31-641044153 ORCID ID: http://orcid.org/0000-0003-0782-2704
Received on Monday, 7 August 2017 09:40:52 UTC