RE: PROV-ISSUE-444 (prov-o-to-last-call): Review PROV-O for last call [PROV-O HTML]

Hi Tim

I understood [1] as take the 'dictionary' concepts and move them in a separate document,
and keep the rest unchanged.  We had just been through a round of discussion, for
which there seems to be agreement on Collection, EmptyCollection and the membership
as currently described in the dm.

I agree though that it is a good idea to change the name to hadMembers or similar.

Regards,
Luc



[1] http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/meeting/2012-06-22#resolution_2

________________________________________
From: Timothy Lebo [lebot@rpi.edu]
Sent: Monday, July 09, 2012 1:39 PM
To: Luc Moreau
Cc: public-prov-wg@w3.org
Subject: Re: PROV-ISSUE-444 (prov-o-to-last-call): Review PROV-O for last   call [PROV-O HTML]

Luc,

On Jul 9, 2012, at 4:05 AM, Luc Moreau wrote:

>
> ... and no qualified form for membership.
>
> Dont' we want subtyping and identification ?

I never got the impression that qualified membership was part of what "stayed in" during our F2F vote.
We continually said "Collection and hadMember", and never mentioned "qualifiedMembership and Membership".

So, what was the intent of the group?

Or, does DM intrinsically connect these and I just misinterpreted?

Thanks,
Tim

>
> Luc
>
> On 07/09/2012 09:02 AM, Luc Moreau wrote:
>> Hi prov-o team,
>>
>> It seems there is another non-alignment between prov-o and prov-dm.
>> Isn't there a prov:EmptyCollection class in the ontology?
>>
>> Luc
>>
>>
>> On 07/04/2012 03:02 PM, Luc Moreau wrote:
>>> Hi prov-o team, again,
>>>
>>> Find below some specific comments about the provo document.
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks for the extensive work!
>>> It needs some polishing, but the majority of it, can happen after LC.
>>>
>>> Answer to your questions:
>>>
>>> 1) Are there any issues that should delay the WG's release of PROV-O as Last Call (i.e., is all of the technical work done).
>>>
>>> - Minor Issues in the ontology raised in my previous message
>>> - Definition alignment, and make sure that example don't use constructs incorrectly (e..g hadRole)
>>>
>>> 2) Are the examples and scenario adequate?
>>>
>>> - Yes, though I couldn't follow the scenario anymore without a picture. Can a picture be added, with the style adopted by other documents
>>>
>>> 3) Should the links to prov-dm, prov-constraints, and prov-n stay in the cross reference?
>>>
>>> - See comment below.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Specific comments:
>>>
>>> Section 1
>>> - owl-rl -> orl-rl ++
>>> - para 3: provdm introduces a MINIMAL set of concepts ... delete MINIMAL
>>> - "... which facilitate a fixed interpretation and use of the prov data model concepts based on the formal semantics of owl2: " delete
>>> - reference to xml-schema should be to xml-schema11 (owl2 automatically switched to xml-schema11)
>>>
>>> section 2:
>>> - "the terms in this category ARE APPLIED IN the same way ..." not sure what this mean.
>>>
>>> section 3.1:
>>> - "the starting point category is a small COLLECTION ..." to avoid confusion, use SET instead.
>>>
>>> - definitions entity/activity/etc need updating
>>>
>>> - "In this case, the Agent that influenced an Activity or Entity prov:actedOnBehalfOf another Agent that MAY HAVE HAD LESS INFLUENCE, but still bears some responsibility for the resulting Activity or Entity."   I am not sure we should say this at all.  The agent may or may not have had more or less influence.
>>>
>>>
>>> - http://example.org# -> http://example.org/# ?   everywhere
>>>
>>> - example after fig 1: it would be nice to see a "prov-style" picture
>>>
>>> - example 2 (agent derek) ... it was suggested for prov-dm that
>>>  examples should be described in past tense. It should be done here
>>>  too.
>>>
>>> - i don't understand wy ex:post9821v1 is a specialization of ex:post9821,
>>>  I can see it's an alternate. (in example code and in text)
>>>
>>> - inmediately->immediately
>>>
>>> - "Since the provenance produced by the activities of Derek and Monica correspond to different user views, the system automatically publish it in different prov:Bundles (ex:bundlePost and ex:bundlePost1)." I don't understand.  It is part of the scenario? or is part of prov?
>>>
>>>
>>> - I am lost in the example without a picture
>>>
>>> - Suggestion: number examples
>>>
>>> - an example still has prov:hasAnnotation
>>>
>>> - "and all the data related to the post is lost. " permanently?
>>>
>>> - example: bundles have not been used, so what is their point?
>>>
>>> - figure 3: can we keep the conventions used elsewhere: agent is represented by pentagon.
>>>
>>> - comments in some of the example (e.g. qualified usage) go beyond the box, into the margin
>>>
>>> - cross referencing, I am not against it, I am concern about the additional space it takes.
>>>  Can it be folded in the title section?
>>>  It's probably too early at this stage to link to constraints, though
>>>  this would be valuable once the prov-constraints document is stable.
>>>
>>> - examples: dererk -> dereck
>>>
>>> - examples: to save space, can we define all prefixes upfront and avoid repeating them
>>>
>>> - prov:wasDerivedFrom contains definition of entity, and not of derivation
>>>
>>> - prov:Bundle: the text talks about account
>>>
>>> - prov:Bundle: maybe should state the purpose: provenance of provenance
>>>
>>> - prov:alternateOf: contains definition of software agent
>>>
>>> - <> prov:wasDerivedFrom < .... dm ...>  :
>>>  I guess it's always good to eat our own dog food, but I think this complicates
>>>  the examples.
>>>
>>> - prov:invalidatedAtTime the painter seem to be destroyed in 2012???
>>>
>>> - prov:mentionOf/specializationOf: have software agent as definition.
>>>
>>> - prov:value:  "The main value  ... of a STRUCTURED value."
>>>  What is structured, here?
>>>
>>> - prov:wasInvalidatedBy example:
>>> Is it right to say swissair_flight_111_crash prov:used <http//db.... swissair_flight_111>?
>>>
>>> - prov:Influence and its subclasses: can they be used alone without a concrete  influence?
>>>  Shouldn't the text say something and RECOMMEND the use of subclasses?
>>>
>>> - prov:Communication is not allowed in the domain of atLocation (see
>>>  example for prov:Communication)
>>>
>>> - typo: prov:Actvity in example with policySale
>>>
>>> - Delegation is not in the domain of hadRole (see insuranceAgent_Frank)
>>>
>>> - example of derivation goes into margin
>>>
>>> - EntityInvolvment: comments that appear in the example should be given in the narrative.
>>>
>>> - Quotation no longer has hadQuoter and hadQuoted in prov-dm
>>>
>>> - prov:Revision, the binary wasAttributedTo is incorrectly qualified by an Association
>>>  instead of Attribution
>>>
>>> - example for prov:hadGeneration
>>>  has a qulaifiedDerivation,
>>>   dont' you need to specifiy influencer entity?
>>>
>>> -  no role allowed in attribution
>>>
>>> :nationalRegionsList
>>>   a prov:Entity;
>>>   prov:qualifedAttribution [
>>>      a prov:Attribution;
>>>      prov:agent   :civil_action_group;
>>>      prov:hadRole :owner;
>>>   ]
>>> .
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> - no role in delegation
>>>
>>> :chauffeur
>>>   a prov:Person;
>>>   prov:actedOnBehalfOf :celebrity-in-car;
>>>   prov:qualifiedDelegation [
>>>      a prov:Delegation;
>>>      prov:agent   :celebrity-in-car;
>>>      prov:hadRole :employer; # The celebrity employed the chauffeur during the enforcement.
>>>   ];
>>> .
>>>
>>> - prov:qualifiedDerivation
>>> :bar_chart
>>>   prov:wasDerivedFrom :aggregatedByRegions;
>>>   prov:qualifiedDerivation [
>>>      a prov:Derivation;
>>>      prov:hadGeneration :illustration;
>>>   ];
>>> .
>>>
>>> Shouldn't you link to :aggregatedByRegions;?
>>>
>>> - qualifiedInvalidation: check time of crash
>>>
>>> - prov:qualifiedQuotation uses quoter/quotedAgent
>>>
>>>
>>> - qualified source
>>> :temperatureDisplay
>>>   a prov:Entity;
>>>   prov:hadOriginalSource :sensorReading20120510;
>>>   prov:qualifiedSource [
>>>      a prov:Source;
>>>      prov:entity         :sensorReading20120510;
>>>   ];
>>> .
>>>
>>> Isn't there a RECOMMENDation to use the qualified pattern only if it adds new information?
>>> It does not do it here.
>>>
>>>
>>> - qualified usage
>>>
>>> :newsPublication
>>>   a prov:Activity;
>>>   prov:used :tsunami_image;
>>>   prov:qualifiedUsage [
>>>      a prov:Usage;
>>>      :hasCopyrightPermission :licensedUse;
>>>      :hasOwner               :reuters;
>>>   ];
>>>
>>> Need to add prov:influencer tsunami_image
>>>
>>>
>>> -
>>>
>>> prov:ProvenanceService
>>> prov:hasAnchor  prov:hasProvenance  prov:hasProvenanceService  prov:provenanceUriTemplate
>>> Should not be described in the html document, but in the paq document.
>>>
>>>
>>> -  appendix
>>> # Instead of defining their own, modelers should use the
>>> # recommended inverse local name within the PROV namespace:
>>>
>>> This is confusing. So, it would be better to say that they are defined in prov namespace
>>> though not defined in prov-o.html ( a bit like paq stuff). It would be informative.
>>>
>>> - OWL2 primer should be normative reference
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 04/07/2012 10:26, Luc Moreau wrote:
>>>> Hi prov-o team,
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for producing the document. Here are a few comments on the ontology, before I start reading
>>>> the html document.
>>>>
>>>> I think you removed too many of the property characteristics, some of which are prov-o specific
>>>> (as opposed to being prov-constraints specific).
>>>>
>>>> Otherwise,  I think the ontology is aligned with prov-dm. I think that Influence and influencer are
>>>> quite nice!
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Luc
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 1. hadRole: why is domain defined as intersection of Influence and six of its subclasses.
>>>>   Why not the subclasses directly?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 2. qualifiedXXX: shouldn't they be inverseFunctional?
>>>>  Otherwise, this would allow for a given Influence instance, to be a qualified Influence
>>>>  for multiple subjects. This is not intended.
>>>>
>>>>  The qualified pattern is prov-o specific. It was inverse functional before, but I think
>>>>   this characteristic was incorrectly removed.
>>>>
>>>> 3 influencer: should it be functional: there is only one influencer per
>>>> qualified pattern instance, isn't there.
>>>>
>>>> 4. Likewise:
>>>> hadPlan: is functional
>>>> hadUsage: is functional
>>>> hadGeneration: is functional
>>>> hadActivity: is functional
>>>>
>>>>   As per prov-dm.
>>>>
>>>> 5. generatedAtTime: In owl file: editorialNote "It is the intent that the property chain holds: (prov:qualifiedGeneration o prov:atTime) rdfs:subPropertyOf prov:generatedAtTime."@en
>>>>
>>>> --> It cannot be functional since qualifiedGeneration is not functional.
>>>>
>>>> Also applies to all the others, invalidatedAtTime, startedAtTime, endedAtTime,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Luc
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 03/07/2012 21:20, Provenance Working Group Issue Tracker wrote:
>>>>> PROV-ISSUE-444 (prov-o-to-last-call): Review PROV-O for last call [PROV-O HTML]
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/track/issues/444
>>>>>
>>>>> Raised by: Timothy Lebo
>>>>> On product: PROV-O HTML
>>>>>
>>>>> PROV-O is ready for internal review for Last Call release.
>>>>>
>>>>> The document is at:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/prov/raw-file/tip/ontology/last-call/2012-07-03-internal-review/Overview.html
>>>>>
>>>>> Please respond to this thread with general feedback and answers to the following questions:
>>>>>
>>>>> 1) Are there any issues that should delay the WG's release of PROV-O as Last Call (i.e., is all of the technical work done).
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 2) Are the examples and scenario adequate?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 3) Should the links to prov-dm, prov-constraints, and prov-n stay in the cross reference?
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Tim prov:actedOnBehalfOf :prov-o-team .
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>>
>
> --
> Professor Luc Moreau
> Electronics and Computer Science   tel:   +44 23 8059 4487
> University of Southampton          fax:   +44 23 8059 2865
> Southampton SO17 1BJ               email: l.moreau@ecs.soton.ac.uk
> United Kingdom                     http://www.ecs.soton.ac.uk/~lavm
>
>
>

Received on Monday, 9 July 2012 12:59:40 UTC