Re: do we have a right to be forgotten?

My views are also my own;  indeed, at the moment I am more exploring than sharing views.

I don't think we do have a right to delete public information about us.  I am not sure it's achievable (can you imagine trying to get a server in Zimbabwe cleaned of information?).  I'm not sure it's technically definable or achievable.  And I am not sure it's even desirable for me, let alone for society as a whole -- as I said, if the mechanism exists to make someone's records disappear, who is to say who has their hand on the lever?

However, one of the snags with network-based information is its reach and persistence;  if you see me buying something in a shop, for sure, that's knowledge you had.  But you pass it on to few people, and with time, the 'fact' atrophies and dies away -- no-one remembers it any more. If I buy something online, it can easily be remembered for ever, and if that fact becomes public on the internet ('I saw Dave buying XX at YY yesterday') it would be accessible globally and persistently.  Even matters of public record used to be hard enough to access, requiring physical presence in often inconvenient locations (e.g. accessing a newspaper's microfilm library).

On Mar 14, 2011, at 21:05 , Ian Fette (イアンフェッティ) wrote:

> NB: the views expressed are my own and may not represent the views of my employer.
> 
> I think that many people believe that information is out there for good, and that society is adjusting to a new normal -- everyone has done things that they may at some point regret, and that we need to adjust as a society to the fact that this information is out there. You're not going to find an employee/spouse/... who has nothing bad about them on the Internet. Certainly I see a number of young people who think nothing of posting pictures of their drunken selves (often under 21) on Facebook for all to see. I would argue that they do so not because they believe they have a right / expectation that such information is recallable at a later date, but rather because societal views are slowly shifting to a recognition that yes, we all have been in a similar situation at some point, and in the grand scheme of things it's not such a big deal. Look at Bill Clinton and his famous quote "When I was in England, I experimented with marijuana a time or two, and I didn't like it. I didn't inhale and never tried it again." 
> 
> The persistence of information is hardly new. A hundred years ago, whatever a newspaper published about someone (accusations from a prosecutor or what have you) are probably still accessible on microfiche in libraries around the country, regardless of the eventual outcome of that trial. The information is simply more readily accessible, but it's not like the information wasn't out there previously. 
> 
> I'm not sure which way you're arguing, but frankly I'm not sure that we have ever had the right to recall information, nor frankly the means -- otherwise, if we do, I want to go back to elementary school and "recall" the time another kid called me dorky, or "recall" from people's memory the time I let a goal through as keeper and lost the game for my team, or heck, why don't I recall everything bad that has ever been noted of me until I can pose for a saint? How far do you go?
> 
> On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 8:37 PM, David Singer <singer@apple.com> wrote:
> OK, but then we find
> 
> Teacher put on admin. leave for having acted in pornographic movies -- in the distant past.
> <http://articles.nydailynews.com/2011-03-08/news/28686352_1_adult-films-exotic-dancer-teacher>
> 
> She did nothing illegal;  heck, if she had, she would have served her time and then to a large extent it wouldn't be legal to use that against her. But society punished her anyway.
> 
> And even in a slander or libel case, one doesn't get the right to have the accusations become as if they never existed; one gets the right to rebut and seek damages for the consequences.
> 
> 
> 
> Do we really have a right to insist that facts about us become un-known?
> 
> 
> On Mar 14, 2011, at 14:24 , Ian Fette (イアンフェッティ) wrote:
> 
>> That would be doubleplusungood.
>> 
>> On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 2:18 PM, David Singer <singer@apple.com> wrote:
>> <http://yro.slashdot.org/story/11/03/14/1919238/Should-We-Have-a-Right-To-Be-Forgotten-Online?from=rss&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+slashdot%2FeqWf+%28Slashdot%3A+Slashdot%29>
>> 
>> Personally, I hope not.  If the mechanisms exist such that I can exercise them and cause myself to be forgotten, someone else can exercise those same mechanisms on anyone's behalf.
>> 
>> Anyone want to be an 'unperson'? <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Newspeak_words#Unperson>
>> 
>> 
>> David Singer
>> Multimedia and Software Standards, Apple Inc.
>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
> David Singer
> Multimedia and Software Standards, Apple Inc.
> 
> 

David Singer
Multimedia and Software Standards, Apple Inc.