W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-low-vision-a11y-tf@w3.org > March 2016

Minutes: Low Vision Task Force telecon 16 March 2016

From: Jim Allan <jimallan@tsbvi.edu>
Date: Wed, 16 Mar 2016 10:36:56 -0500
Message-ID: <CA+=z1WnQ-8wvjzRb_QPh8yw6x-xzreTxDrTy4rGpjFdWw3i4tg@mail.gmail.com>
To: public-low-vision-a11y-tf <public-low-vision-a11y-tf@w3.org>
source: https://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html

Low Vision Accessibility Task Force Teleconference 16 Mar 2016

See also: IRC log <http://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-irc>
Attendees
PresentShawn, JimA, Wayne, JohnRochford, Laura, jeanne, AndrewK, Erich
RegretsChairJimA and AWKScribejimA
Contents

   - Topics <https://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#agenda>
      1. CSUN <https://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#item01>
      2. legibility <https://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#item02>
      3. Legibility and Readability
      <https://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#item03>
      4. lvtf-ACTION-37: Avila to create user need for contrast differences
      <https://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#item04>
      5. lvtf-Action-37 contrast differences
      <https://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#item05>
      6. review Sensory Characteristics
      <https://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#item06>
      7. Sensory Characteristics
      <https://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#item07>
      8. Information from Images - User Need?
      <https://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#item08>
      9. Information from Images - User need
      <https://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#item09>
      10. lvtf-ACTION-38: Review 3.1 contrast/color user needs
      <https://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#item10>
      11. lvtf-Action-38 - contrast/color user needs
      <https://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#item11>
   - Summary of Action Items
   <https://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#ActionSummary>
   - Summary of Resolutions
   <https://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#ResolutionSummary>

------------------------------

<allanj> clear agenda

<allanj> ​Agenda+ Legibility and Readability and ???

<allanj> v

<Wayne> shawn? are you listening

<allanj> Open item 1
CSUN

Shawn going to CSUN

<allanj> jim going

Wayne going

not John, Laura, Erich

Low Vision: Beyond the Buzz Words

<
http://www.csun.edu/cod/conference/2016/sessions/index.php/public/presentations/view/337
>

A panel comprised of individuals with low vision will discuss the meaning,

techniques/devices, and best practices for optimizing the “low vision” web

experience.

<JohnRochford> Jim: Found 1 low-vision presentation at CSUN 2016

<Zakim> shawn, you wanted to suggest contacting panelists and lett ing them
know about our publication & work

Presenters

Joel Isaac

Wayne Heidel

Olaya Landa-Vialard

Scott McCormack

<JohnRochford> Shawn: Contact CSUN panelists and let them knw about our
work?

Date & Time

Friday, March 25, 2016 - 1:20 PM PST

Location

Cortez Hill AB, 3rd Floor, Seaport Tower

<AWK>
http://www.csun.edu/cod/conference/2016/sessions/index.php/public/presentations/view/337
legibility

<JohnRochford> Wayne admits to not being cool.

<allanj> close item 1

https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/LVTF_Open_Issues#Legibility_and_Readability_and_.3F.3F.3F

<AWK> I sent a note to Jon A about the session
Legibility and Readability

<JohnRochford> Wayne: Asked Gordon about about legibility levels.

[ Shawn put in a late comment this morning: "Keeping in mind the audience
and purpose of the document, I think we want to keep it a jargon-less as
possible. Maybe we don't even try to define terms -- we just explain the
concepts?"]

<JohnRochford> Wayne: Proposed 3 levels to Gordon, which he liked.

<JohnRochford> Wayne: font size, line spacing, etc., Gordon includes in
legibility

"things that are legible that you really can't read"

<JohnRochford> Wayne: There are things that are legible that people can't
read.

<JohnRochford> Wayne: Acuity limit = legible font that can be read

<JohnRochford> Wayne: Critical Print Size is second level, and is dependent
upon context, such as font and font size

<allanj> acuity limit = from eye exam under best conditions, limit of
persons acuity

<JohnRochford> Wayne: These levels exist for everybody

"see and recognize letters but functinoally not read too well"

<allanj> update paragraph in Requirements document:
http://w3c.github.io/low-vision-a11y-tf/requirements.html#functional-vision

<JohnRochford> Shawn: we should define terms "legibility" and "readability"

in doc:
http://w3c.github.io/low-vision-a11y-tf/requirements.html#functional-vision

current draft paragraph: [Editors' Note: The Task Force plans to change the
content of this paragraph.] Tasks may also impact a person’s functional
vision. For example, a person may be able to distinguish letters at a given
point size on a vision test where they are reading only one letter at a
time, but they cannot actually read blocks of text at that same point size.
This is the difference

between legibility and readability. Legibility is related to perceiving
text by distinguishing letters. Readability is related to reading and
comprehending textual information. Thus text could be somewhat legible to a
person, yet not functionally readable—with effort that user could
distinguish one letter from another, but could not effectively read
sentences.

<scribe> *ACTION:* Shawn and Wayne add to
https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/References#Functional_Vision
legibility references [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-40 - And wayne add to
https://www.w3.org/wai/gl/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/references#functional_vision
legibility references [on Shawn Henry - due 2016-03-23].

<JohnRochford> Wayne: As experts on how to make things work on the web, we
have the right to use operationalized terms

<JohnRochford> Wayne: as well as defining success criteria

<JohnRochford> Shawn, am I confusing Wayne with Jim?

<JohnRochford> I apologize

<scribe> *ACTION:* Shawn and Wayne update legibility readability section in
https://rawgit.com/w3c/low-vision-a11y-tf/FPWD/requirements.html#functional-vision
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-41 - And wayne update legibility readability
section in
https://rawgit.com/w3c/low-vision-a11y-tf/fpwd/requirements.html#functional-vision
[on Shawn Henry - due 2016-03-23].

<allanj> close item
lvtf-ACTION-37: Avila to create user need for contrast differences

<allanj> close item 2

<allanj> topic lvtf-Action-37 contrast differences
lvtf-Action-37 contrast differences

in tracker: https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/track/actions/37

last comment:
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-low-vision-a11y-tf/2016Mar/0052.html

<JohnRochford> Shawn: User need that started the conversation was the state
of a button

<JohnRochford> Is luminosity a sufficient affordance - does it fall under
"do not use color alone"?

<allanj>
http://w3c.github.io/low-vision-a11y-tf/requirements.html#not-relying-on-color

<JohnRochford> That was from Shawn

<JohnRochford> Shawn: Add an example of color indicating a state

proposal: add as an example under 3.1.3 Not Relying on Color "User Need -
Color: Color is not the only visual means of conveying information,
indicating an action, prompting a response, or distinguishing a visual
element."

<JohnRochford> Wayne: Yes, contrast is a function of color, but in common
usage, people don't think of contrast as being a color issue

<allanj> original 3.1.3 text: User Need - Color: Color is not the only
visual means of conveying information, indicating an action, prompting a
response, or distinguishing a visual element.

<JohnRochford> Shawn: Let's put the example in place and see if it works.

<JohnRochford> Wayne: Agrees

<scribe> *ACTION:* Shawn write out example for 3.1.3 that covers contrast
issue [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#action03]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-42 - Write out example for 3.1.3 that covers
contrast issue [on Shawn Henry - due 2016-03-23].
review Sensory Characteristics

<allanj> close item 3

<JohnRochford> AWK: In communication with Jon A about this issue
Sensory Characteristics

https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/LVTF_Open_Issues#Sensory_Characteristics

WCAG 1.3.3 Sensory Characteristics: Instructions provided for understanding
and operating content do not rely solely on sensory characteristics of
components such as shape, size, visual location, orientation..."

What are relevant issues particularly for low vision? Do we want to address
this with a user need? If so, ideas for wording?

<JohnRochford> Shawn: WCAG 1.3.3 jumped out at me

<JohnRochford> Shawn: Want to run it by people

<JohnRochford> Jim: Anybody object to closing this?
Information from Images - User Need? Information from Images - User need

<allanj> user need - low vision user need access to alt text at times

<JohnRochford> Wayne: This relates to issue of focus on screen-readers

<allanj> laura: users can perceive important information from images (alt
text, modifying image, etc.)

<JohnRochford> Laura: There are lot of low-vision people who don't (? -
Laura, please define)

<JohnRochford> Jim: What do we want to do: craft a user need?

<JohnRochford> Shawn: Are we going to say users can get the info from an
image?

<JohnRochford> Wayne: No, that's perceiving.

<JohnRochford> Laura: Agrees

<scribe> *ACTION:* Shawn draft images user need under 3.3 Perceiving for TF
discussion [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#action04]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-43 - Draft images user need under 3.3 perceiving
for tf discussion [on Shawn Henry - due 2016-03-23].
lvtf-ACTION-38: Review 3.1 contrast/color user needs

<allanj> close item 5

<JohnRochford> Wayne: Will carefully go through user needs next week

here are the user stories - use cases
https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/User_stories_-_use_cases
there are are few open issues, which we have listed in
https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/LVTF_Open_Issues
lvtf-Action-38 - contrast/color user needs

<JohnRochford> Wayne: Do we have any recommendations to WCAG for button
state issue?

<JohnRochford> Jeane: I think somebody from the group should comment on it.

<JohnRochford> AWK: I have been weighing in about this issue to the
conversation going on

<JohnRochford> AWK: Most of debate was about on-focus and on-hover

<allanj> scribe: jimA

<allanj> trackbot, end meeting
Summary of Action Items *[NEW]* *ACTION:* Shawn and Wayne add to
https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/References#Functional_Vision
legibility references [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#action01]
*[NEW]* *ACTION:* Shawn and Wayne update legibility readability section in
https://rawgit.com/w3c/low-vision-a11y-tf/FPWD/requirements.html#functional-vision
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#action02]
*[NEW]* *ACTION:* Shawn draft images user need under 3.3 Perceiving for TF
discussion [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#action04]
*[NEW]* *ACTION:* Shawn write out example for 3.1.3 that covers contrast
issue [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/03/16-lvtf-minutes.html#action03]

Summary of Resolutions [End of minutes]

-- 
Jim Allan, Accessibility Coordinator
Texas School for the Blind and Visually Impaired
1100 W. 45th St., Austin, Texas 78756
voice 512.206.9315    fax: 512.206.9264  http://www.tsbvi.edu/
"We shape our tools and thereafter our tools shape us." McLuhan, 1964
Received on Wednesday, 16 March 2016 15:37:26 UTC

This archive was generated by hypermail 2.3.1 : Thursday, 27 April 2017 14:44:29 UTC