- From: Felix Sasaki <fsasaki@w3.org>
- Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2006 00:22:27 +0900
- To: "public-i18n-core@w3.org" <public-i18n-core@w3.org>
... are at http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html and below
as text. There are two action items which I added manually:
* Felix to classify open LTLI issues
* All to read Marks comments on IDNA issues
Felix
[1]W3C
[1] http://www.w3.org/
i18n core WG
24 Oct 2006
[2]Agenda
[2]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2006Oct/0011.html
See also: [3]IRC log
[3] http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-irc
Attendees
Present
Felix, Francois, Mark, Mary
Regrets
Karunesh, Richard, Vijay
Chair
Francois
Scribe
Felix
Contents
* [4]Topics
1. [5]previous minutes
2. [6]actions
3. [7]LTLI discussion
4. [8]idna issue
* [9]Summary of Action Items
_________________________________________________________
previous minutes
Francois: approved
actions
<scribe> ACTION: everybody to look for issues in
[10]http://www.w3.org/TR/timezone (ONGOING) recorded in
[11]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action01]
[10] http://www.w3.org/TR/timezone
input from Felix at
[12]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2006Oct/001
4.html
[12]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2006Oct/0014.html
Francois: not clear what the difference between "UTC offset" and
"zone offset"
Felix: it's the same
Francois: maybe Mark has something to say on this
... let's wait a week or so
<scribe> ACTION: Felix to look for possible participants for the ws
i18n work (ONGOING) [recorded in
[13]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action02]
<scribe> ACTION: Felix to write a mail about possibility for SVG
tiny specific IRI tests to martin and the i18n core list (ONGOING)
[recorded in
[14]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action03]
mail about the talk with Chris
[15]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-core/2006OctDec/
0010.html
[15]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-core/2006OctDec/0010.html
<scribe> ACTION: Francois to give input to wiki for the LTLI summary
(ONGOING) [recorded in
[16]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action04]
<scribe> ACTION: Francois to reply to Schema WG on normalization
issue. (PENDING) [recorded in
[17]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action05]
<scribe> ACTION: Francois to build a current issues list on charmod
norm (ONGOING) [recorded in
[18]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action06]
<scribe> ACTION: Felix to update the review radar (DONE) [recorded
in [19]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action07]
LTLI discussion
editor's copy at [20]http://www.w3.org/International/core/langtags/
[20] http://www.w3.org/International/core/langtags/
<fyergeau> [21]http://www.w3.org/International/core/langtags
[21] http://www.w3.org/International/core/langtags
francois: language identification part is fine
... needs updating for the RFCs
mark: the pointer to BCP 47 , you have to be careful
... you only get to a part of the BCP. Send a note to the RFC-editor
that there should be a pointer for both RFCs
<scribe> ACTION: Felix to send a note to the RFC editor on the
reference to the location of BCP 47 - RFCs [recorded in
[22]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action08]
<mark> [23]http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/bcp/bcp47.txt
[23] http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/bcp/bcp47.txt
mark: this link leads not to the matching part. in the LTLI draft,
there is a different link
ftp://ftp.rfc-editor.org/in-notes/bcp/bcp47.txt
francois: which one is the offical one?
mark: not sure
francois: we can update the entry in the LTLI draft
felix: I'll do
francois: the parts on language identification is fine
... we have more work as we work at locales
felix: is it still o.k. to concentrate on best practices for
"language versus locale", and not define the field values like CLDR?
mark: yes
francois: LTLI should give recommendations how to specify locales on
the web, kind of "best practices"
Mary: in some cases encoding was part of a locale
Francois: in posix, but that was not good
... this could be a subject we could address
discussion on various locale models
mark: java and cldr are almost purely on language
felix: besides "locale versus language", how about matching? should
LTLI talk about it?
mark: could be
... as Richard pointed out, many people put in some language
information not exactly
... we did a search what people put in accept-lang , and it is a
mess
... e.g. many people put in the underbar instead of a dash
... we would canonicalize those
... the use of xml:lang or lang as attributes gets even worse
felix: a kind of BP for matching in e.g. http and xml?
mark: bp for receivers / senders
francois notes IE7 and language negotiation
mark: it is extremly fuzzy what a "locale" means
... does "en-US" means my citizenship? the place I am on vacation?
francois: agree, but the language tag received from a browser is not
from where you are travelling
mark: it is the language of my browser setting
... there is nothing we can do to influence people to set up their
browser
francois: people will not read the w3c spec and set up their browser
mark: we do language detection on documents
... we don't rely on the tags
... that includes both xml:lang and the http header
... there is a lot of material mistagged
... going back to locale:
... I would recommend BP for a user should do , a browser / UA, a
server, a receipient
felix: sounds good
francois: on web applications
... which resemble more desctop applications than web pages
... for whose, we need to describe how an application could gather
the information
mark: at least make the relationship between language and locale
clearer would be good
... we don't want to say too much on how locales are used
francois: I agree
... let's just say "it varies", and the application needs to find
out how to deal with it
... we will end up with examples saying e..g "the country is not
everything!"
... if a user contacts a server, there is an initial request
... you have to start from that point and use the right language
... the language again is in the center
mark: language is the core of any notion of locale
francois: is there any other stuff than language which is always
available?
idna issue
mark: I looked it over
... the klensin document was seriously flawed
felix: we could reply as a group, or as w3c liaison
mark: I would suggest i18n core looks over the proposal, and w3c
sees if you reply as liaison to ietf
francois: why are they excluding so much?
mark: the ietf draft is very suspicious on combining characters. you
can't write e.g. indic language without these
... the approach is very euro centric
francois: is the appraoch in principle o.k., i.e. to say what is
included, and not what is excluded?
mark: at least the unicode identifiers should be available
... they are removing lots of stuff in response to not clearly
defined problems
francois: the underlying problem is security, right?
mark: excluding symbols like a "heart" does not help security
Summary of Action Items
[NEW] ACTION: Felix to send a note to the RFC editor on the
reference to the location of BCP 47 - RFCs [recorded in
[24]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action08]
[NEW] ACTION: Felix to to classify open LTLI issues
[NEW] ACTION: All to read Marks comments on IDNA issues
[PENDING] ACTION: everybody to look for issues in
[25]http://www.w3.org/TR/timezone recorded in
[26]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action01]
[PENDING] ACTION: Felix to look for possible participants for the ws
i18n work [recorded in
[27]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action02]
[PENDING] ACTION: Felix to write a mail about possibility for SVG
tiny specific IRI tests to martin and the i18n core list [recorded
in [28]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action03]
[PENDING] ACTION: Francois to build a current issues list on charmod
norm [recorded in
[29]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action06]
[PENDING] ACTION: Francois to give input to wiki for the LTLI
summary [recorded in
[30]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action04]
[PENDING] ACTION: Francois to reply to Schema WG on normalization
issue. [recorded in
[31]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action05]
[25] http://www.w3.org/TR/timezone
[DONE] ACTION: Felix to update the review radar [recorded in
[32]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-i18ncore-minutes.html#action07]
[End of minutes]
_________________________________________________________
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Received on Tuesday, 24 October 2006 15:22:44 UTC