Re: Solutions to unify middle dot usage in Traditional Chinese

猿も木から落ちる :-)

> On Dec 10, 2014, at 10:29 AM, Phillips, Addison <addison@lab126.com> wrote:
> 
> My bad. I knew that. Apparently the coffee isn’t having any effect this morning.
>  
> Thanks for the correction.
>  
> From: Ken Lunde [mailto:lunde@adobe.com] 
> Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 10:27 AM
> To: bobbytung@wanderer.tw; public-zhreq@w3.org; Phillips, Addison
> Cc: public-i18n-cjk@w3.org; public-html-ig-zh@w3.org
> Subject: RE: Solutions to unify middle dot usage in Traditional Chinese
>  
> Addison,
> 
> Using U+FF0E as a middle dot is a Very Bad Idea™, because it is a full-width full stop (period) that happens to be centered according to Traditional Chinese conventions.
> 
> U+30FB is also not good due to its heavy Japanese connections.
> 
> Regards...
> 
> -- Ken
> 
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: Phillips, Addison [addison@lab126.com]
> Received: Wednesday, 10 Dec 2014, 9:57
> To: Bobby Tung [bobbytung@wanderer.tw]; public-zhreq@w3.org[public-zhreq@w3.org]
> CC: CJK discussion [public-i18n-cjk@w3.org]; 中文HTML5同樂會ML [public-html-ig-zh@w3.org]; Ken Lunde [lunde@adobe.com]
> Subject: RE: Solutions to unify middle dot usage in Traditional Chinese
> 
> Hi Bobby,
>  
> I would think that U+30FB would never be appropriate as a middle dot in Chinese (even though it is sometimes used, possibly because legacy fonts display it in a more graceful manner than the Latin or full width dots).
>  
> I tend to agree about using U+00B7 as middle dot with Traditional Chinese text presenting it as full width in most contexts. What you don’t mention is whether Simplified Chinese prefers U+00B7 to be halfwidth. Certainly most Latin script fonts will have U+00B7 as proportional (and thus not full width). That makes the text layout of undifferentiated Hanzi text complicated (don’t know which presentation of middle dot to use).
>  
> What is the allergy to using FF0E?
>  
> Addison
>  
> From: Bobby Tung [mailto:bobbytung@wanderer.tw] 
> Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 6:23 AM
> To: public-zhreq@w3.org
> Cc: CJK discussion; 中文HTML5同樂會ML; Ken Lunde
> Subject: Solutions to unify middle dot usage in Traditional Chinese
>  
> Hello,
>  
> There's a problem I found about the middle dot usage in Traditional Chinese.
>  
> --Usage
>  
> Middle dot for Traditional Chinese has 3 usages list below: 
>  
> 1, separates translated latin name in Hanzi, e.g. 理查・石田
>  
> 2, as decimal point in Hanzi e.g. 三・一四
>  
> 3, separates book, chapter, title e.g.  詩經・魏風・碩鼠
>  
> In Traditional Chinese, the Middle dot should be full-width and a filled round dot in the middle.
>  
> --Codepoint
>  
> There's some codepoints general used for the middle dot in Traditional Chinese.
>  
> ·         U+00B7          MIDDLE DOT
> ‧        U+2027           HYPHENATION POINT
> ・      U+30FB          KATAKANA MIDDLE DOT
> ．      U+FF0E          FULLWIDTH FULL STOP
>  
> And in Simplified Chinese usage, the middle dot is U+00B7.
>  
> U+00B7 from A150 and U+2027 from A145 on BIG 5 code table[1]. 
>  
> But I think U+00B7's definition more suitable for the middle dot than U+2027 / U+FF0E. 
>  
> --Solutions
>  
> Considering about interoperability and codepoint definition, I have 2 proposals.
>  
> 1. use U+00B7 as general middle dot, if authors want to let it full-width, use U+30FB. But most Chinese fonts do not have the glyph, certainly fallback to Japanese font. [2]
>  
> 2. use U+00B7 as general middle dot, and in Traditional Chinese subset, let glyph be full-width. 
>  
>  
> =====
>  
>  
> 各位，我發現繁體字的中點在使用上相當混亂，想藉寫中文排版需求時把標準訂下來，提出兩個方案。
>  
> 先提出繁體字「連接號」（舊稱音節號）使用的狀況：
>  
> 1, 用來分隔漢譯姓與名，例如：理查・石田
>  
> 2, 作為漢字數字的小數點，例如：三・一四
>  
> 3, 用來分隔書、章、作品名，例如：詩經・魏風・碩鼠
>  
> 而在繁體字的用法上，連接號應該為全形/全角，為置中的實心點。
>  
> 再來從實際的文件上，會發現有最常使用的四個Codepoints：
>  
> ·         U+00B7          MIDDLE DOT
> ‧        U+2027           HYPHENATION POINT
> ・      U+30FB          KATAKANA MIDDLE DOT
> ．      U+FF0E          FULLWIDTH FULL STOP
>  
> 簡體字則是統一使用U+00B7，而U+00B7來自BIG 5的A150，但我認為U+00B7的定義比較符合使用狀況，所以不考慮使用U+2027與U+FF0E。
>  
> 所以提出的方案如下：
>  
> 1, 使用U+00B7作為標準中點，若作者想要全形，則使用U+30FB，但因為這個Codepoint許多中文字型沒有造，所以幾乎一定會Fallback到日文字型。
>  
> 2, 使用U+00B7作為標準中點，但在繁體字字型中，將其造為全形。
>  
>  
> [1]: http://www.khngai.com/chinese/charmap/tblbig.php?page=0

> [2]: http://www.unicode.org/reports/tr11/

>  
>  
> 
> WANDERER Digital Publishing Inc.
> Bobby Tung @bobtung
> Mobile：+886-975068558
> bobbytung@wanderer.tw
> http://wanderer.tw

>

Received on Wednesday, 10 December 2014 20:39:47 UTC