- From: Leif Halvard Silli <xn--mlform-iua@xn--mlform-iua.no>
- Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 21:36:06 +0100
- To: Steve Faulkner <faulkner.steve@gmail.com>
- Cc: Leif Halvard Silli <xn--mlform-iua@xn--mlform-iua.no>, HTMLWG WG <public-html@w3.org>
Steve Faulkner, Thu, 14 Mar 2013 20:21:48 +0000: > Recommending that the text is provided as text on screen benefits a wide > range of users that are currently locked out by the use of the title > attribute. Wide range of users? More than the 'keyboard only users' that you initially cited? That's a side issue here: The true motivation for the proposed change, seems a little different from what you inititally stated. Leif H Silli Steve Faulkner, Thu, 14 Mar 2013 20:21:48 +0000: >> But, at least seen from a VoiceOver perspective, there are some >> drawbacks to the solutions you propose. Also, I’m sure many authors >> would like to have invisible help tags/descriptions. > > there are drawbacks to all of the methods, its a matter fo finding the one > that is simplest, most robust and works for the greatest number of people. > > Recommending that the text is provided as text on screen benefits a wide > range of users that are currently locked out by the use of the title > attribute. > > That is the thrust of the change. > > The examples I suggested are simple and robust which is why i suggested > them. > > with regards > > SteveF <http://www.paciellogroup.com/resources/wat-ie-about.html> > -- > HTML 5.1 <http://www.w3.org/html/wg/drafts/html/master/> > <http://www.paciellogroup.com/resources/wat-ie-about.html> > > > On 14 March 2013 20:11, Leif Halvard Silli <xn--mlform-iua@xn--mlform-iua.no >> wrote: > >> Steve Faulkner, Thu, 14 Mar 2013 18:13:31 +0000: >>>> >>>> I don't understand why you keep telling me what the AX inspector says >>>> when I have made I it so very clear that I fully trust that you give >>>> accurate information about the AX inspector. >>> >>> I was talking about what voicoever announced not what inspector displayed >> >> OK. Having switched VoiceOver to English, I can verify. My very bad. >> >>> * I have explained to you about repeated text - and no repeated texts. >>> >>> you have drawn a conclusion about repeated text, not one that I share >> based >>> on experience with observing how users interact with forms. >> >> More attention than conclusion, IMO. >> >> To a VoiceOver user, what comes across as most 'clean'? The title >> attribute solution currently in the text, or one or both of your >> proposed replacement examples? >> >> If L = 'Part number', H = the instruction text and E = cue to edit the >> text field, then the VoiceOver experiences can be summarized like so:˙ >> >> Current spec: LHLE >> Your example 1: LLHEH >> Your example 2: LLEH >> >> All the above are automatically read to the user. The difference >> between your two examples w.r.t. what is automatically read to the user >> before the edit text cue, is interesting. >> >> Regarding help tag upon request: In the current spec example, the title >> attribute is used as help tag text. In your first example, there is no >> specific 'help tag', as VO sees it - everything is read if the user >> asks for help tag. In your second example, the aria-describedby text is >> used as help tag. >> >> To me, the behavior that the current spec example generates, seems more >> straight forward. But of course, I don't have not observed users using >> a form. Neither do I know how other ATs present the examples. >> >> But, at least seen from a VoiceOver perspective, there are some >> drawbacks to the solutions you propose. Also, I’m sure many authors >> would like to have invisible help tags/descriptions. >> -- >> Leif Halvard Silli
Received on Thursday, 14 March 2013 20:36:36 UTC